Astus wrote:I don't see the "virgin birth" part here. That would presume he had at least a mother. But it says he had no parents at all.
Astus wrote:Says he had an illusion body. Nirmanakaya (化身 - 身化). Looked as if it was from father and mother, but wasn't. Half a parent could still be "half real/impure".
Astus wrote:I'd rather vote for the whole conception-birth as an illusion. If only the conception was unreal but birth real, well, tricky causal situation, don't you think? Not to forget that the whole buddha-life story was an illusion. Well, in Mahayana.
catmoon wrote:Virgin birth. Are you serious? You really want to discuss that?
This is very far from the matter of ending suffering.
And at another place,
"Reverend Ananda, the Tathagatas have the body of the Dharma - not a body that is sustained by material food. ... Ananda, do not be ashamed, and go and get the milk!"
The Diamond Sutra sums up neatly,
"What the Tathāgata calls a perfectly-formed body is not a perfectly-formed body. Hence it is called a perfectly-formed body."
catmoon wrote:So if we are going to believe that Buddha had a virgin birth, I suppose next we are going to have to believe there are little white elephants running around making people pregnant? Maybe we should all believe the Jonah story while we're at it? And of course if Buddha had a virgin birth there is no reason to disbelieve the Immaculate Conception story either, is there? Geee maybe we should all go be Jehovah's Witnesses or something.
Does Vasubandhu actually affirm that there is a real cause for unreal effects? It is contradictory by the way. No, those are just examples. Vasubandhu doesn't say that mind is real, that's a misinterpretation of mind only.
Causal efficacy works within illusion and not something real creating the illusion. It's more like in the Srimaladevi Sutra, shadowmen killing each other.
Lazy_eye wrote:Just out of curiosity, how was little Rahula conceived? Was he also "conjured like an illusion"?
And can any of this be tied in with Vimilakirti who manifested children despite being chaste?