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PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:07 am 
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Amito Fo,

In Buddhism, ultimately the goal is to become a Buddha. Buddha's do not have sex. So I will explain a bit about this Precept (rule) so you can more quickly bcome a Buddha.

If you are a Buddhist Monk the rule is simple, No Sex of Any Kind is allowed. This rule is the #1 rule in the Vinaya. The Vinaya are the rules which the Buddhist Monks must follow. They tell us who is a monk and who is not. If a Buddhist Monk breaks this rule they lose their Monkhood and are no longer considered a monk.

If you are a Layperson only sex between 1 Man and 1 Women in Marriage is allowed. All other kinds are considered Inappropriate Sex and are a violation of the Precept. This rule is 1 of a group of 5 common Precepts that lay people may take.

Some of the kinds of Inappropriate Sex not supported by Buddhism are

Man + Man - Gayism
Women + Women - Lesbianism
Man + Women (Outside of Marriage)
Bisexualism
Multiple Partners at the same time
Sex with Animals (Beastiality)
Self sex

Amito Fo,

Enjitsu


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 1:04 am 
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Are these the official teachings of Shingon or are these your own summations?
And what is the text source by the way?

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 6:10 am 
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I think these comply with the precepts valid in tibetan buddhism or at least these valid according the lamrim of Tsongkhapa. But there are further precepts.
Although there is no explict mention of gay and lesbian sex from what is stated it is to be inferred that only "straight" vaginal intercourse amongst heterosexual couples is considered appropriate. However there are inappropriate times and inappropriate places. Of course adultery is inappropriate.

Kind regards


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 3:57 pm 
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I have two questions...

in this faith of buddhism laypeople do not make determinations in such matters. So is the IP a layperson or not, and if not why are such determinations being made in this school of buddhism by a layperson. Neither do laypersons determine who is a member of a sanga or any other matter concerning the structure of this buddhist faith.

NUmber 2.....if this person is a ordained person. Why is there a over concern with the sexual?
There are thousands upon thousands of issues that a monastic or ordained person may expound upon research discuss and emply.....why is sex being considered the main focus here if ordained?

So please answer those two questions.

Your home states you are a westerner representative of buddhism.....what do you mean by that? Does that mean you are a lineage holder or not. Ordained or not?

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 10:24 pm 
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enjitsu wrote:
Amito Fo,

In Buddhism, ultimately the goal is to become a Buddha. Buddha's do not have sex. So I will explain a bit about this Precept (rule) so you can more quickly bcome a Buddha.

If you are a Buddhist Monk the rule is simple, No Sex of Any Kind is allowed. This rule is the #1 rule in the Vinaya. The Vinaya are the rules which the Buddhist Monks must follow. They tell us who is a monk and who is not. If a Buddhist Monk breaks this rule they lose their Monkhood and are no longer considered a monk.

If you are a Layperson only sex between 1 Man and 1 Women in Marriage is allowed. All other kinds are considered Inappropriate Sex and are a violation of the Precept. This rule is 1 of a group of 5 common Precepts that lay people may take.

Some of the kinds of Inappropriate Sex not supported by Buddhism are

Man + Man - Gayism
Women + Women - Lesbianism
Man + Women (Outside of Marriage)
Bisexualism
Multiple Partners at the same time
Sex with Animals (Beastiality)
Self sex

Amito Fo,

Enjitsu


No Vinaya system I'm aware of says that sex outside of marriage is inappropriate. Definitely not the Sarvastivadin tradition of Vinaya. Also, from what source do you base your assertion that abstinence from sex is the #1 rule of the Vinaya? That seems strange, since killing seems like a much greater non-virtue.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 9:59 am 
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Pema Rigdzin wrote:
enjitsu wrote:
Amito Fo,

In Buddhism, ultimately the goal is to become a Buddha. Buddha's do not have sex. So I will explain a bit about this Precept (rule) so you can more quickly bcome a Buddha.

If you are a Buddhist Monk the rule is simple, No Sex of Any Kind is allowed. This rule is the #1 rule in the Vinaya. The Vinaya are the rules which the Buddhist Monks must follow. They tell us who is a monk and who is not. If a Buddhist Monk breaks this rule they lose their Monkhood and are no longer considered a monk.

If you are a Layperson only sex between 1 Man and 1 Women in Marriage is allowed. All other kinds are considered Inappropriate Sex and are a violation of the Precept. This rule is 1 of a group of 5 common Precepts that lay people may take.

Some of the kinds of Inappropriate Sex not supported by Buddhism are

Man + Man - Gayism
Women + Women - Lesbianism
Man + Women (Outside of Marriage)
Bisexualism
Multiple Partners at the same time
Sex with Animals (Beastiality)
Self sex

Amito Fo,

Enjitsu


No Vinaya system I'm aware of says that sex outside of marriage is inappropriate. Definitely not the Sarvastivadin tradition of Vinaya. Also, from what source do you base your assertion that abstinence from sex is the #1 rule of the Vinaya? That seems strange, since killing seems like a much greater non-virtue.


Sometimes it came up before where the Layperson wants to know the Vinaya. The monk say that laypeople are not allowed to know the Vinaya that it is for monks information only. And furthermore the monk say that if we read that it is considered as stealing.

However, the situation arise sometimes where western people want to become Monk but do not know the rule. (Vinaya) I worry that the people who want to become monk will hesitate or choose not to become monk because they are afraid of the unknown rules they will need to follow.

So out of compassion I will make some link to the information available. I cannot garuntee this information in the link. http://www.buddhanet.net/budsas/ebud/ebsut067.htm

Also, due to terrible behavior by people these days who say they are Monk (but are not really monk because they do not follow the Vinaya.) However, the layperson cannot get access to Vinaya easily and so cannot know if their Monk is real monk who follows all the rules or Fake monk who break all the rules.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 11:46 am 
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Do you have any idea what your actions here have spoken about your own level of knowledge, clarity and the many issues that is being confused and lumped into one roll? Besides being evasive on answering direct questions of many in your other raised threads and claims...

1. Posting into the Shingon Forum with a topic and content which is irrelevant to its intricate history, tradition, system and practice. Could you share with us exactly what have you known on Shingon, especially in the light of the raised subject? The link given is only relevant and used in the Chinese Mahayana Tradition...although of academic interest to others as well. Apples and oranges?

2. Discussing a part or all of the Precepts without qualifications/citation of which Tradition, context, text and other sources most needed to have a balanced and right view of the subject. All that has been seen is merely some 'emotional outburst' or at worst a Vatican style of throwing a 'dogmatic' statement here.
At least the Vatican issues an exhaustive list of references when doing so...

3. Perhaps, our learned Monastic members here may kindly consent to give us their insights on these...
Quote:
Sometimes it came up before where the Layperson wants to know the Vinaya. The monk say that laypeople are not allowed to know the Vinaya that it is for monks information only...

However, the situation arise sometimes where western people want to become Monk but do not know the rule. (Vinaya) I worry that the people who want to become monk will hesitate or choose not to become monk because they are afraid of the unknown rules they will need to follow.

Also, due to terrible behavior by people these days who say they are Monk...


Quote:
I cannot garuntee this information in the link. http://www.buddhanet.net/budsas/ebud/ebsut067.htm

Then why bother linking it in the first place? Or by what authority/standard do you have to 'guarantee' it?

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