Alien & UFOs thread...

[plwk]

Where did Buddha come from ?
It wasn't Earth.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tushita

Ah yes, nice but falsifiable? Lumbini seems quite earthly though....

Should we be building spacecraft instead of meditating?

Ahem...re-Dhammakaya?

[dharmagoat]

Should we be building spacecraft instead of meditating?

Ahem...re-Dhammakaya?

I think they need a bigger one.

[Aemilius]

Cooper was a conspiracy-obsessed individual.
Conspiracy theories, lacking verifiable evidence, draw more and more external 'causes' into an ever-growing web of paranoia.
When skeptics demand hard evidence for extraordinary claims,
conspiracy-obsessed people often see those skeptics as part of the conspiracy.
it's a never-ending loop.

There is much more credible evidence, photos, videos, and so forth, of crack-pots than there are of visitors from space.

But even if there are visitors from space,
okay, so what does that have to do with Buddhism?

That is disappointing.
Do You nevertheless admit there are secrets in the modern society?

As to an intelligent person there most certainly are secrets and secret projects, how could you ever avoid this circle of accusations of "conspiracy theories"? These kind of things, like the cheap accusation of ascribing to "conspiracy theories", are caused by the primary cause of secrets and secret projects.

What has it got to do with buddhism? Good question. But Buddhism doesn't mean that you must be a simpleton, or an idiot, who believes everything that he is told by the government, by the news agencies and other such agencies.
Bill Cooper says in his lecture that social scientists had come to the conclusion that the knowledge of extraterrestial entities would result in a collapse of western religion, and even in a collapse of the whole modern society.

Buddhism is a religion that accepts there is life elsewhere in the universe. Buddhism speaks of the trisahasra-mahasahasra-lokadhatu, the world system of thousand million worlds.
Seems that it has something to do with buddhism, in this and in other ways. Realizing Dharma is seeing reality as it is. The existence of extra terrestial entities, or extra terrestial life, is an aspect of reality as it is.

[PadmaVonSamba]

Do You nevertheless admit there are secrets in the modern society?

Your logic:
A.There are things the government hides from people.
B.There are many things we wonder about ETs that we do not have answers to
C. Therefore, the government is hiding the answers.
.
.
.

[SpinyNorman]

I am regularly abducted by aliens but I can't remember it because they wipe my memory each time. I know it's happening because I wake up sore from all the probing...

[PadmaVonSamba]

Well, I guess I was wrong. But I never thought UFOs would be that small.

[Aemilius]

Do You nevertheless admit there are secrets in the modern society?

Your logic:
A.There are things the government hides from people.
B.There are many things we wonder about ETs that we do not have answers to
C. Therefore, the government is hiding the answers.

It doesn't start like that, a more correct logic would be:

A. Our knowlwdge is dependent on sense perception.
B. Our knowledege is also dependent on other people's sense perception
C. Therefore, there is always an element of trust in our knowledge.

D. Trust is created by behaviour, and by many other things, like: titles, appeareance, manner of speech, clothing, etc.... How trust is generated is discussed in sociology and certain other sciences.

E. We can take a case example of William "Bill" Cooper. Let's say that for certain reasons we believe that what he says is the actual truth.
F. The information that was revealed by William Cooper implies that there are things that are kept hidden.
G. If there are hidden and secret things in our society, it means that they are covered behind a facade.
H. This facade consist of untruths.

I. For these reasons it seems pretty clear that the society has several levels:
1. There are the masses who believe what the facade says.
2. There are people whose job is to build up this facade.
3. There is some kind of elite, a restricted class of persons, who know what the actual truth is.

[Aemilius]

If anyone thinks that "there are no secrets", please see The Groom Lake Desert Rat, it is an excellent source material:
http://www.ufomind.com/area51/desert_rat/

[Iain]

I've had a few missing time episode experiences. After one of them I recalled a tall spindly grey being informing me he was from a sort of parallel universe and he was indeed a parallel version of me!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... laims.html

[steveb1]

I don't see that the ufo subject can be anything but tangential to informed Buddhism or informed Christianity for that matter.

If ufo's don't represent anything truly anomalous, we can forget about them;
If ufos are anomalous, we should probably try to identify them as much as we are capable of doing;
If ufos are supertechnology from non-terrestrial sources (including "Interdimensional beings"), identification may pose serious difficulties;
If ufos are a mix of non-terrestrial supertechnology / and/or cryptoterrestrial-ultraterrestrial beings and artifacts / and/or psychic/parapsychological creations of what Jung called the psychoid realm ... then they may not even be sufficiently physical to ever "catch" and dissect.

I don't see how any of these considerations impact essential spiritual questions - if we dismiss the fundamentalist notion that such manifestations must necessarily be "of the Devil" or, otoh, "angels of the Lord", then the phenomena become questions for science, parapsychology, depth psychology, mythogenesis, etc. The only Buddhistic concern that I can imagine would be to recognize - if appropriate to any particular phenomenon - as a sentiency which ought to be the object of Dharmic compassion.

[Aemilius]

I don't see that the ufo subject can be anything but tangential to informed Buddhism or informed Christianity for that matter.

If ufo's don't represent anything truly anomalous, we can forget about them;
If ufos are anomalous, we should probably try to identify them as much as we are capable of doing;
If ufos are supertechnology from non-terrestrial sources (including "Interdimensional beings"), identification may pose serious difficulties;
If ufos are a mix of non-terrestrial supertechnology / and/or cryptoterrestrial-ultraterrestrial beings and artifacts / and/or psychic/parapsychological creations of what Jung called the psychoid realm ... then they may not even be sufficiently physical to ever "catch" and dissect.

I don't see how any of these considerations impact essential spiritual questions - if we dismiss the fundamentalist notion that such manifestations must necessarily be "of the Devil" or, otoh, "angels of the Lord", then the phenomena become questions for science, parapsychology, depth psychology, mythogenesis, etc. The only Buddhistic concern that I can imagine would be to recognize - if appropriate to any particular phenomenon - as a sentiency which ought to be the object of Dharmic compassion.

Buddhism has this idea and capacity called all-knowing, sarvajña, knowledge of all existent things. Universe, its structure, content and nature, falls into the area of all-knowing.
This question has vast consequences for the majority of people. Buddhism also has vast consequences for the human population, for that matter, and therefore the vast majority is unwilling to accept that it (buddhism) exists. For example, the majority of people will not accept the idea of karma and rebirth. Also the existence of aryas, i.e. somehow more developed or persons, is unacceptable for the majority, and it is not among the generally accepted religious ideas. The consciousness of animals is also hard to swallow and it has vast consequences.
A buddhist concern would also be whether there are Aryas among the Ebes, or Extraterrestrial biological entities.

What is happening is that the society is becoming, and it has become already, stratified into separate categories or stratum concerning the knowledge of extraterrestrial life and everything it entails. I don't wish that all buddhists should be in the category of "stupid ordinary people".

[steveb1]

Aemilius wrote, "I don't wish that all buddhists should be in the category of "stupid ordinary people".

Agreed. I wasn't saying that Buddhists should be ignorant about ufos, the paranormal, cryptozoology and other "fringe" subjects. I was only saying that I don't see a spiritual connection or meaning in these kinds of phenomena, other than insasmuch as they may include sentient beings, the Buddhistic attitude would be one of Dharmic compassion toward such beings. The flip side to this is that Buddhistic Bodhi, redemption, enlightenment, etc., is not dependent on knowledge of anything except the Dharma. "The Dharma saves" - not ufos and the paranormal.

[Aemilius]

Aemilius wrote, "I don't wish that all buddhists should be in the category of "stupid ordinary people".

Agreed. I wasn't saying that Buddhists should be ignorant about ufos, the paranormal, cryptozoology and other "fringe" subjects. I was only saying that I don't see a spiritual connection or meaning in these kinds of phenomena, other than insasmuch as they may include sentient beings, the Buddhistic attitude would be one of Dharmic compassion toward such beings. The flip side to this is that Buddhistic Bodhi, redemption, enlightenment, etc., is not dependent on knowledge of anything except the Dharma. "The Dharma saves" - not ufos and the paranormal.

Actually there is a natural and logical connection: When you attain the dhyanas, or states of meditation, you will perceive the corresponding objective realms, that exist on those levels of consciousness.
This area is problematic, because on one hand you are encouraged to meditate, on the other hand there are thousands of people ready to condemn everything that you see or perceive, because of meditation, as "a pure hallucination".
What is "being saved by Dharma", when no one will allow you to attain anything at all, that exists in reality?
I don't deny that there are hallucinations too.

[Paul]

Eric Ouellet was on Binnall of America and he's got one of the most interesting takes on UFOs I've heard from in a long time. He connects the patterns that are experienced in parapsychological events - specifically poltergeists - with UFO flaps quite convincingly. It's quite a Jungian take on things, which is right up my street. You can hear it here: http://www.binnallofamerica.com/boaa091115.html

Here's his website: http://parasociology.blogspot.co.uk/

His book is excellent.

[Jesse]

I was just watching a UFO documentory earlier. For anyone who's interested it's actually pretty good. It deals mainly with trustworthy accounts. High ranking government officials, mass sightings, military reports etc. They try to avoid the crazy guy talking about being probed by the reptilians kind of stuff, and focus on more solid evidence. Haha..

Interestingly enough, I think in 2007(?) there was a conference in washington, DC for high profile, or well respected people to tell their UFO stories, and urge the us. government to release information that's been covered up etc.

Note-worthy people from the conference: John Mccain, Fife Symington(Ex govenour of Arizon), The Ex-National Defense Minister of the USA, and many other current & ex Military Staff / Nasa Employees / high ranking dipolomats(from the us and other countries), politicians etc.

Even the lead investigator from Project Blue Book ( The US Air-Forces UFO invesigation operation ), comes clean and explains he was told to tow the party line of: Deny, Lie and downplay all events related to UFO's. They didn't want to alarm people, or cause panic etc in the population. He was basically told to lie in his reports.

I think because of the subject matter, it takes quite a bit of convincing for most people to accept there is a good deal of evidence for alien life visiting us. With the amount of recorded footage, and personal accounts most anything else would have been accepted as real by now. At the very least it's facinating to consider that aliens visit our planet on the regular.

phpBB [video]

Did a quick search and found the UFO Conference was in 2013, in Wash. DC. Here's the video:

phpBB [video]

[Karma Dorje]

Note-worthy people from the conference: John Mccain, Fife Symington(Ex govenour of Arizona), The Ex-National Defense Minister of the USA, and many other current/ex Military Staff / high ranking dipolomats, politicians etc.

Wait, a politician from Arizona is trustworthy? What strange parallel universe are we talking about here?

[Jesse]

Note-worthy people from the conference: John Mccain, Fife Symington(Ex govenour of Arizona), The Ex-National Defense Minister of the USA, and many other current/ex Military Staff / high ranking dipolomats, politicians etc.

Wait, a politician from Arizona is trustworthy? What strange parallel universe are we talking about here?

What does a diplomat have to gain by saying he saw a UFO? If anything doing that would damage his reputation and make people doubt his sanity. Not a good play imo.

[Paul]

phpBB [video]

This is indeed one of the best documentaries out there on UFOs.

Mirage Men is also a must see. It shows how the UFO narrative has been deliberately used to manipulate people - especially for Cold War related reasons.

[joy&peace]

Cold War also did a lot of division-creating stuff. Which is why I have been non-political, considering both sides equally my family- seems to be the only way to heal the rift, which has never made much sense to me. My birth family, naturally perhaps, was on one side of the political divide- for many years I have had this current view. It is very beneficial both to myself and to others, I believe. I noticed people who do the debate thing, tend to eventually become more entrenched, and so I learned to practice this way more often.

As for possibility of extra-terrestrial life having visited, it has always been moderately interesting, certainly, to me. I have not been convinced when I was younger; still do not have much of an opinion one way or the other; a while back, I did feel very comfortable with one thing, however, which is that it would be interesting to meet them, probably, and I certainly wouldn't have any fear over such a meeting. This was definitely a pleasant feeling.

On the same topic, an interesting food for thought is- the similarity of some understandings from Buddhism; now, for those who would not ever believe unless they saw- which is certainly understandable enough- this might seem silly; but I do notice for instance, that descriptions of Amitabha's retinue would be similar, that is, are or were similar to a further advanced civilization, etc.

When I was younger, I did watch one or two of the ancient astronaut shows with my friend, Cris, and he was fairly into them; I was fairly skeptical, and I noticed the show seemed to be rather emphasizing the viewpoint that they did visit and do certain things- I have not ever been a big fan of persuasion; since a child, growing up with my family, building on their knowledge, and the best way I put it later on in years was- only use persuasion as a last resort, and for peace- the reason for this is, it is, in its basic sense, interfering with other people; let them live their lives and so forth is the primary thing; and so when I communicate with people I tend to come from this approach.
Namaste, peace and metta,
j.

[Aemilius]

Have You seen or heard about the book Secret Journey to Planet Serpo, by Len Kasten ?
It has an appendix about a briefing to President Ronald Reagan, which took place in March 1981.
This briefing is really interesting, it deals about Ebes and their communications with and visits to planet Earth.