Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

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Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:15 pm

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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Sherab Dorje » Thu Aug 14, 2014 5:22 pm

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"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Mkoll » Fri Aug 15, 2014 4:01 am

Welcome to conspiracy-land!
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:07 pm

Mkoll wrote:Welcome to conspiracy-land!

Did you actually watch it ? For how long?
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Mon Aug 18, 2014 4:23 pm




This is a clearcut introduction to the topic of Dan Burisch; who he is, why? and so on..
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Mkoll » Tue Aug 19, 2014 1:00 am

Aemilius wrote:
Mkoll wrote:Welcome to conspiracy-land!

Did you actually watch it ? For how long?

Been there, done that. I used to watch and listen to Project Camelot some years ago soon after they started, back when Bill and Kerry were doing interviews together. I watched this exact same interview you posted in full.

I've heard so many people talking about their conspiracy theories regarding a secret space program, ETs, MJ-12, etc. and the thing is, many of them contradict each other, including Mr. Burisch's. The only conclusion is that some of these people are lying or misinformed.

And one more thing about Mr. Burisch, in case you didn't know:

Wikipedia wrote:In 2004, Dan Burisch (pseudonym of Dan Crain) claimed to have worked on cloning alien viruses at Area 51, also alongside the alien named "J-Rod". Burisch's scholarly credentials are the subject of much debate, as he was apparently working as a Las Vegas parole officer in 1989 while also earning a PhD at State University of New York (SUNY).[61]


~~~

I stay away from conspiracy-land because frankly, it's not conducive to my well-being and much of it is BS.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:58 pm

Mkoll wrote:
Aemilius wrote:
Mkoll wrote:Welcome to conspiracy-land!

Did you actually watch it ? For how long?

Been there, done that. I used to watch and listen to Project Camelot some years ago soon after they started, back when Bill and Kerry were doing interviews together. I watched this exact same interview you posted in full.

I've heard so many people talking about their conspiracy theories regarding a secret space program, ETs, MJ-12, etc. and the thing is, many of them contradict each other, including Mr. Burisch's. The only conclusion is that some of these people are lying or misinformed.

And one more thing about Mr. Burisch, in case you didn't know:

Wikipedia wrote:In 2004, Dan Burisch (pseudonym of Dan Crain) claimed to have worked on cloning alien viruses at Area 51, also alongside the alien named "J-Rod". Burisch's scholarly credentials are the subject of much debate, as he was apparently working as a Las Vegas parole officer in 1989 while also earning a PhD at State University of New York (SUNY).[61]


~~~

I stay away from conspiracy-land because frankly, it's not conducive to my well-being and much of it is BS.


Well, I'm not so well versed in this lore as You are. I know there are many things that always contradict some other things, or what these same people have said before. I wouldn't label it "a conspiracy land", though. This lore has some bearing on buddhism too.
In buddhism too many things or truths contradict other things and other teachings. In buddhism there has been, and there still are, secret issues and esoteric and hidden practices, that are covered behind a screen of public teachings. You will quite certainly find out their existence as you travel far enough on the buddhist path.

Enlightenment includes what is called allknowledge, sarvajña. Enlightened persons should know the truth about this topic too. It is little known that vimanas or flying mansions are mentioned in the Mahayana and Sravakayana sutras and other literature. They appear even in the Ashoka inscriptions. The word vimana, or its chinese counterpart, has been mistranslated as merely palaces in certain modern interpretations of the Lotus sutra and the Pureland literature. Thus we lose the idea of flying palaces or flying structures altogether.

Long ago when I read the Hundred Thousand Songs of Milarepa I was struck by an episode in which there appear large eyed creatures in his cave, who read his books while Milarepa was away. I saw these creatures as similar to the modern aliens or what are called the "greys".

That some people have been robbed their credentials and their whole careers is not something unique to only Dan Burisch. Who can tell what can be done to you, in this field??
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Paul » Tue Aug 19, 2014 6:20 pm

Aemilius wrote:I know there are many things that always contradict some other things, or what these same people have said before.


The UFO field is something that fascinates me. I love it. But it is completely full of liars and the insane. There is also the fact that it has been a testing ground for deliberate confusion of people for profit or to throw people off the scent of things like the stealth bomber etc.. The best example of that must be Paul Bennewitz. With respect to the whole MJ12 thing, remember that they were revealed by Bill Moore, who was involved in the Bennewitz affair as recruit of AFOSI. He admitted spying on the UFO community for various government organisations. So why would you trust a word he says or any MJ12-related stuff?

I really, really strongly recommend getting your hands on the work of George Hansen. His work on the trickster, marginality and anti-structure is amazing and really explains the reason why you should expect this from such a field - and also how/why to protect yourself from some of the fallout. For example, check minute 26 onwards of this (or the whole thing):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vM38ilurOqk

:alien:
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That spontaneity I was told is the dakini aspect.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Mkoll » Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:54 am

Aemilius wrote:Well, I'm not so well versed in this lore as You are. I know there are many things that always contradict some other things, or what these same people have said before. I wouldn't label it "a conspiracy land", though. This lore has some bearing on buddhism too.

Perhaps for you. It has no bearing on my Buddhist practice.

I label it "conspiracy land" because that's what it is. It's like stepping through a minefield where the mines are lies and misinformation. Not the kind of land I want to spend my time in.

Aemilius wrote:In buddhism too many things or truths contradict other things and other teachings. In buddhism there has been, and there still are, secret issues and esoteric and hidden practices, that are covered behind a screen of public teachings. You will quite certainly find out their existence as you travel far enough on the buddhist path.

I don't subscribe to the belief that there are secret, private Buddhist teachings available only to the initiated. (It's a conspiracy theory! :P)

Aemilius wrote:That some people have been robbed their credentials and their whole careers is not something unique to only Dan Burisch. Who can tell what can be done to you, in this field??

He could have been set up: that's certainly a possibility. But that's what most* conspiracy theories are: a whole lot of possibilities. And the possibilities are endless when one starts thinking about who is lying (why are they lying? who are they lying for? are they just delusional?), if there is a set-up (who set them up? who benefits? why? is it a gov't psy-op? which gov't?), etc. I believe thinking this way is a recipe for mental unease.

That rabbit hole doesn't end. And the rabbit who owns it is ornery.

*Note that I am not talking about real conspiracies such as Operation Paperclip, MK Ultra, and COINTELPRO, to name a few.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:34 am

Mkoll wrote:
Aemilius wrote:Well, I'm not so well versed in this lore as You are. I know there are many things that always contradict some other things, or what these same people have said before. I wouldn't label it "a conspiracy land", though. This lore has some bearing on buddhism too.

Perhaps for you. It has no bearing on my Buddhist practice.

I label it "conspiracy land" because that's what it is. It's like stepping through a minefield where the mines are lies and misinformation. Not the kind of land I want to spend my time in.

Aemilius wrote:In buddhism too many things or truths contradict other things and other teachings. In buddhism there has been, and there still are, secret issues and esoteric and hidden practices, that are covered behind a screen of public teachings. You will quite certainly find out their existence as you travel far enough on the buddhist path.

I don't subscribe to the belief that there are secret, private Buddhist teachings available only to the initiated. (It's a conspiracy theory! :P)


It is not that simple, I'm afraid. It may seem to be like that. That there are no secrets, nothing esoteric and so on.., but it is not completely true. In fact it is not true at all.
There are things that are naturally secret, and you will get to know them gradually, when you attain the levels of the stream entrant, once-returner, non-returner or arhat, or the bhumis and levels of the bodhisattva path. You don't need to believe it, but vast amounts of knowledge exist on these levels, waiting for You.
Thus after some ten or twenty years of diligent practice of Dharma, you will once again enter the "conspiracy land" that truly exists!
Last edited by Aemilius on Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:41 am

Paul wrote:
Aemilius wrote:I know there are many things that always contradict some other things, or what these same people have said before.


The UFO field is something that fascinates me. I love it. But it is completely full of liars and the insane. There is also the fact that it has been a testing ground for deliberate confusion of people for profit or to throw people off the scent of things like the stealth bomber etc.. The best example of that must be Paul Bennewitz. With respect to the whole MJ12 thing, remember that they were revealed by Bill Moore, who was involved in the Bennewitz affair as recruit of AFOSI. He admitted spying on the UFO community for various government organisations. So why would you trust a word he says or any MJ12-related stuff?

I really, really strongly recommend getting your hands on the work of George Hansen. His work on the trickster, marginality and anti-structure is amazing and really explains the reason why you should expect this from such a field - and also how/why to protect yourself from some of the fallout. For example, check minute 26 onwards of this (or the whole thing):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vM38ilurOqk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

:alien:


Thanks!
I'll check this George Hansen guy at some point. I may have heard about the trickster theory/explanation long ago, it sounds kind of familiar.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Mkoll » Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:37 am

Aemilius wrote:It is not that simple, I'm afraid. It may seem to be like that. That there are no secrets, nothing esoteric and so on.., but it is not completely true. In fact it is not true at all.
There are things that are naturally secret, and you will get to know them gradually, when you attain the levels of the stream entrant, once-returner, non-returner or arhat, or the bhumis and levels of the bodhisattva path. You don't need to believe it, but vast amounts of knowledge exist on these levels, waiting for You.
Thus after some ten or twenty years of diligent practice of Dharma, you will once again enter the "conspiracy land" that truly exists!

Please. I know about different degrees of spiritual attainment. That's not at all what I'm talking about when referring to secret, private Buddhist teachings.

And if you think practicing the Dhamma leads to "conspiracy land", then you are clearly missing something. Paul said that the UFO field is "completely full of liars and the insane" and I would agree with him, only adding that the conspiracy field in general, or "conspiracy land", is full of the same.

And you are equating that with the highest fruits of Buddhist practice?!

Yes, something is missing there.

:rolleye:
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Fri Aug 22, 2014 8:29 am

You mentioned MK Ultra, which is something that not many people know about. What I know about MK Ultra is that there was this girl, or young woman, who had escaped from MK Ultra and who went to several psychiatrists, and no one took her seriously, until she found a psychiatrist who believed her story. And it is a very unbelievable story.
They filed a court case because of it, and because there is this court case, it is now a reality, atleats to an extent. Is that not so?
There is not much difference to the story of Dan Burisch, it is also unbelievable and amazing. But some people believed his story. There is no court case, naturally.

This field is admittedly difficult, or impossible to penetrate, but there are diamonds of knowledge hidden there that are worth digging out, I believe.

As you seem to have suffered mentally from this phenomenon, I understand that you want to have some rest now, and that you want to believe that Buddhism is a zone free of anything resembling Area 51 and the like.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Mkoll » Fri Aug 22, 2014 9:57 am

Aemilius wrote:As you seem to have suffered mentally from this phenomenon, I understand that you want to have some rest now, and that you want to believe that Buddhism is a zone free of anything resembling Area 51 and the like.

Touched a nerve, have I?

~~~

I've said my piece, warning people to be careful of the minefield of lies and delusion that is the conspiracy theory field. If you want to make a home for your mind in that kind of toxic place, that's your prerogative.

Just don't say you weren't warned if you get burned. Really, I wish someone had warned me years ago - it would have saved me a lot of wasted time and effort for less than nothing.

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Paul » Fri Aug 22, 2014 2:05 pm

Aemilius wrote:You mentioned MK Ultra, which is something that not many people know about.


The difference is that MKULTRA was real (although a lot of fantasists have clung onto it), but the whole MJ12 thing was an AFOSI fake. Really, a lot of the UFO conspiracy literature is like bad sci-fi. And in the case of Project Blue Beam - a perennial favourite amongst especially paranoid conspiracy circles - it literally was a Star Trek script: http://secretsun.blogspot.co.uk/2010/11 ... posed.html
This nature of mind is spontaneously present.
That spontaneity I was told is the dakini aspect.
Recognizing this should help me
Not to be stuck with fear of being sued.

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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:53 am

Paul wrote:
Aemilius wrote:You mentioned MK Ultra, which is something that not many people know about.


The difference is that MKULTRA was real (although a lot of fantasists have clung onto it), but the whole MJ12 thing was an AFOSI fake. Really, a lot of the UFO conspiracy literature is like bad sci-fi. And in the case of Project Blue Beam - a perennial favourite amongst especially paranoid conspiracy circles - it literally was a Star Trek script:


The problem is that You really can't prove anything in this field, not very easily anyway. If there are secrets, there are bound to be lies too, to cover what is secret. We have the testimony of others too, like for example William Cooper, that the MJ12 exists. You are free believe what you want, what you think is reasonable, or what you think is likely or possible.

Lecture of William Cooper contains important information on this topic:
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Paul » Mon Aug 25, 2014 9:17 am

You do know that Cooper dropped all of his beliefs about aliens, including the MJ 12 stuff? He considered it was all a hoax. There is no reason to believe otherwise. The close history of its disclosure with known frauds means that there is no reason to believe a word of it.

Alk this reminds me of my favourite Downfall video:
This nature of mind is spontaneously present.
That spontaneity I was told is the dakini aspect.
Recognizing this should help me
Not to be stuck with fear of being sued.

-Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Aemilius » Tue Aug 26, 2014 3:15 pm

Paul wrote:You do know that Cooper dropped all of his beliefs about aliens, including the MJ 12 stuff? He considered it was all a hoax.


This is a common and normal propaganda procedure in the ufo-field, and in buddhism too. There are people, paid or voluntary? -I don't know, but they go around telling people that nowadays you have dropped all your previous beliefs and practices, i.e. the ufos or buddhism, vegetarianism, meditation the rest. That is true unfortunately, You must realize that we live in a world where secret propaganda warfare concerning spiritual matters is taking place constantly.
I have seen the web page of his son, who is still living, and I haven't seen there anything that you claim.
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Paul » Tue Aug 26, 2014 5:39 pm

Aemilius wrote:I have seen the web page of his son, who is still living, and I haven't seen there anything that you claim.


Trust me, I have read, watched and listened to nearly everything Cooper produced. I am quite fond of him, although I disagree with most of his output.

You can see it here:

For many years I sincerely believed that an extraterrestrial threat existed and that it was the most important driving force behind world events. I was wrong and for that I most deeply and humbly apologize.


http://www.hourofthetime.com/majestyt.htm

Also, I really, really think you need to get a meta-understanding of this field. Thinking processes like this:

Aemilius wrote:There are people, paid or voluntary? -I don't know, but they go around telling people that nowadays you have dropped all your previous beliefs and practices, i.e. the ufos or buddhism, vegetarianism, meditation the rest. That is true unfortunately, You must realize that we live in a world where secret propaganda warfare concerning spiritual matters is taking place constantly.


are dangerous to your health and are also really poor critical thinking. Listen to episodes 56 & 57 of Project Archivist, they cover this really well - I assume that you know the guys in the discussion: http://www.projectarchivist.com/?cat=8&paged=8
This nature of mind is spontaneously present.
That spontaneity I was told is the dakini aspect.
Recognizing this should help me
Not to be stuck with fear of being sued.

-Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche
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Re: Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch

Postby Nemo » Tue Aug 26, 2014 6:56 pm

You always hear weird stories in the army. Often from crusty guys who after a few drinks expound on weird things they have seen. In many scientific and other specialized fields expertise becomes magical to the uninitiated. Things in labs are often 30 years from the general public. Take a smart phone back to 1970.
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