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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:25 am 
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catmoon wrote:
CreativeMind wrote:
The poster has mentioned that lots of people have seen the 'lotus', with their bare eyes and not through a camera lens I presumed.

In this case, the lens flare effect may be ruled out.



The halo is real and a common effect. The lotus is lens flare beyond a shadow of a doubt. You will notice the it does not appear in the same position in each photo, it moves around depending on camera position as lens flare does, and in all of them there is even a small secondary image of the sun in the center of it. If people are claiming to have seen lens flare with the naked eye, they are getting confused with the halo or the reports are garbled together and they are being repeated without rational examination.

This is getting ridiculous. A while back we had a bunch of pictures published here that were taken at night in the rain and the images were spattered with dots of light that were claims to be miraculous "Buddha lights" or something. They were in fact a common effect caused by raindrops getting on the lens. Before you claim a miracle, PLEASE learn a thing or two about photography. Or optics. Or logic. Or anything.

By publishing specious miracle reports you are not doing any service to anyone, you are just making Buddhists appear to be credulous, uneducated bumpkins.


Since when did i publish miracle reports.... Please clarify!


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:55 am 
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CreativeMind wrote:


Since when did i publish miracle reports.... Please clarify!


I don't believe you did. The comment used the general "you" and was not aimed in your direction.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:47 pm 
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I think a better way to understand this is that the practitioners who saw what they believed to be a halo is a sign of progress in their personal practice. Master Kuang Chin said:

    Whatever circumstances we run into, our first thought should always be "reciting the name of the Buddha", nothing else. We will then plant only seeds of recitation in our eighth field of cognition. Therefore, what we should practice daily is to convert all sounds we hear, be it birds singing, vehicles moving, or people talking, into sounds of chanting Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha. That is to say, instead of being distracted, we should integrate all external noises and phenomena into our practice of reciting the name of the Buddha.

So if they thought they saw a halo, I think that's great. If someone gets berated, and they see that person yelling as a bodhisattva, that's good. I think it's a sign of progress. It really doesn't matter if someone sees Amitabha in a slice of toast either.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 1:41 am 
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Quote:
It really doesn't matter if someone sees Amitabha in a slice of toast either.

Image

It's a Hotei! :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 3:49 am 
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Mr. G wrote:
I think a better way to understand this is that the practitioners who saw what they believed to be a halo is a sign of progress in their personal practice. Master Kuang Chin said:

    Whatever circumstances we run into, our first thought should always be "reciting the name of the Buddha", nothing else. We will then plant only seeds of recitation in our eighth field of cognition. Therefore, what we should practice daily is to convert all sounds we hear, be it birds singing, vehicles moving, or people talking, into sounds of chanting Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha. That is to say, instead of being distracted, we should integrate all external noises and phenomena into our practice of reciting the name of the Buddha.

So if they thought they saw a halo, I think that's great. If someone gets berated, and they see that person yelling as a bodhisattva, that's good. I think it's a sign of progress. It really doesn't matter if someone sees Amitabha in a slice of toast either.


They did see a halo, no one is saying they didn't. For technical info, Wiki 22 degree solar halo. It's the lens flare that is a bit contentious. Now if there is really a halo there, and there is no reason to doubt it from any standpoint it's fine to interpret it as an auspicious sign if one wishes. I interpret it as the interaction between hexagonal plate ice crystals and sunlight, but that's just a matter of view.

Of course if you are getting confused between the halo and the lens flare, well :shrug: ...

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 3:50 am 
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catmoon wrote:
Mr. G wrote:
I think a better way to understand this is that the practitioners who saw what they believed to be a halo is a sign of progress in their personal practice. Master Kuang Chin said:

    Whatever circumstances we run into, our first thought should always be "reciting the name of the Buddha", nothing else. We will then plant only seeds of recitation in our eighth field of cognition. Therefore, what we should practice daily is to convert all sounds we hear, be it birds singing, vehicles moving, or people talking, into sounds of chanting Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha. That is to say, instead of being distracted, we should integrate all external noises and phenomena into our practice of reciting the name of the Buddha.

So if they thought they saw a halo, I think that's great. If someone gets berated, and they see that person yelling as a bodhisattva, that's good. I think it's a sign of progress. It really doesn't matter if someone sees Amitabha in a slice of toast either.


They did see a halo, no one is saying they didn't. For technical info, Wiki 22 degree solar halo. It's the lens flare that is a bit contentious. Now if there is really a halo there, and there is no reason to doubt it from any standpoint, it's fine to interpret it as an auspicious sign if one wishes. I interpret it as the interaction between hexagonal plate ice crystals and sunlight, but that's just a matter of view.

Of course if you are getting confused between the halo and the lens flare, well :shrug: ...

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:41 am 
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Mr. G wrote:
I think a better way to understand this is that the practitioners who saw what they believed to be a halo is a sign of progress in their personal practice. Master Kuang Chin said:

    Whatever circumstances we run into, our first thought should always be "reciting the name of the Buddha", nothing else. We will then plant only seeds of recitation in our eighth field of cognition. Therefore, what we should practice daily is to convert all sounds we hear, be it birds singing, vehicles moving, or people talking, into sounds of chanting Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha. That is to say, instead of being distracted, we should integrate all external noises and phenomena into our practice of reciting the name of the Buddha.

So if they thought they saw a halo, I think that's great. If someone gets berated, and they see that person yelling as a bodhisattva, that's good. I think it's a sign of progress. It really doesn't matter if someone sees Amitabha in a slice of toast either.

That is a great quote, thanks Mr. G!

Now this might sound not the most respectful, but every time I go to the toilet it reminds me to contemplate Amitabha's name quietly in my mind. This was most likely caused by my habit in the office, where a toilet break gives me a window of time alone to contemplate Amitabha.

With a newborn daughter, I am conditioning myself to contemplate Amitabha every time I see or hear her. Nowadays her voice is what wakes me up at night and in the morning, so hopefully this will get me into the habit of contemplating Amitabha's name every time I wake up and ensuring rebirth in the West Pure Land when I pass away.

I have read that a primary purpose of a statue, drawing or any image of a buddha or bodhisattva is to remind us of the Buddhist way and practice. In that aspect, anything that can remind you of the same is essentially functioning as a buddha/bodhisattva's image. Yes, that includes a toilet bowl. (No, I do not kneel and bow to a toilet bowl. And hopefully any auspicious sign can wait till I work out of the toilet.)

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:21 am 
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catmoon wrote:
.

Of course if you are getting confused between the halo and the lens flare, well :shrug: ...


I'm not confused at all and it doesn't change the context of my post.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:22 am 
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Kaji wrote:
I have read that a primary purpose of a statue, drawing or any image of a buddha or bodhisattva is to remind us of the Buddhist way and practice. In that aspect, anything that can remind you of the same is essentially functioning as a buddha/bodhisattva's image. Yes, that includes a toilet bowl. (No, I do not kneel and bow to a toilet bowl. And hopefully any auspicious sign can wait till I work out of the toilet.)


:namaste:

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:54 pm 
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Mr. G wrote:
catmoon wrote:
.

Of course if you are getting confused between the halo and the lens flare, well :shrug: ...


I'm not confused at all and it doesn't change the context of my post.



Then I don't understand why you referrred to people "believing" they saw a halo. Is there any reason one might disbelieve it?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:36 am 
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catmoon wrote:
Then I don't understand why you referrred to people "believing" they saw a halo. Is there any reason one might disbelieve it?


Because an atheist would "disbelieve". However as Mahayana Buddhists we know that objects and mind are empty of inherent existence and practitioners can experience pure vision.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:53 am 
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Mr. G wrote:
catmoon wrote:
Then I don't understand why you referrred to people "believing" they saw a halo. Is there any reason one might disbelieve it?


Because an atheist would "disbelieve". However as Mahayana Buddhists we know that objects and mind are empty of inherent existence and practitioners can experience pure vision.


That's all very well I suppose, but why would an atheist disbelieve the photographs? The halo is a common, repeat, common phenomenon, almost as common as a rainbow. Most people have seen them. I have, many times. Mind you the one in the photos here is more intense than most.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 11:28 am 
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catmoon wrote:
That's all very well I suppose, but why would an atheist disbelieve the photographs? The halo is a common, repeat, common phenomenon, almost as common as a rainbow. Most people have seen them. I have, many times. Mind you the one in the photos here is more intense than most.


Because an atheist wouldn't consider the halo a sign of auspiciousness during a Buddhist meditation retreat.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 1:46 pm 
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Mr. G wrote:

Because an atheist wouldn't consider the halo a sign of auspiciousness during a Buddhist meditation retreat.


Hm. What if the atheist in question happened to be a Buddhist? Most Buddhists are atheists, last I heard. They pretty much invented the word "pagan" to describe us. Heathen idolaters, one and all. :twothumbsup:

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:51 pm 
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There's a difference between a Buddhist atheist and a materialist atheist. :tongue:


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:36 pm 
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catmoon wrote:
Hm. What if the atheist in question happened to be a Buddhist?


The "Buddhist Atheist" is a misnomer that has gained popularity. Whether it's Theravada, Mahayana or Vajrayana, the existence of gods are present in teachings. However, people will do their best to modify beliefs to their own suiting.

Quote:
Most Buddhists are atheists, last I heard.


Not at all. Citation please.

This portion of the discussion are all leading off topic however.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:43 pm 
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Traditionally, these signs are viewed as auspicious by Buddhists. This happens so many times at the City of Ten Thousand Buddhas that if people begin to get really excited by seeing rainbow clouds, or halo around the sun, the monastics would tell the lay people to stop looking and focus on practice and cultivation. External conditions should not move the mind, they are somewhat non-conducive to one's practice. Having said that, Master Hsuan Hua did purchase a piece of land near my city which is called "Castle Mountain" and there are various mountains here that have images of Buddha's and Bodhisattvas that are naturally formed due to wind and water erosion.

Amitabha and Guan Yin appears at the side of the mountain: http://www.dharmasite.net/DRBA/img_0088.jpg
Arhats: http://www.dharmasite.net/DRBA/img_0121.jpg
Shakyamuni Buddha laying down: http://www.dharmasite.net/DRBA/img_0027.jpg
http://www.dharmasite.net/DRBA/img_0008.jpg


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:34 pm 
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I dont see anything on the images. Perhaps they are just a product of human mind, like the images of Jesus that many people see.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:11 am 
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catmoon wrote:
Since we're going off topic, I'll start a new thread elsewhere.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:28 pm 
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I don't see why it being a natural scientific occurrence would prevent it from also being an auspicious sign.

"Synchronicity is the experience of two or more events that are apparently causally unrelated or unlikely to occur together by chance, yet are experienced as occurring together in a meaningful manner."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronicity


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