Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

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Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby asunthatneversets » Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:12 am

Which of the 17 Dzogchen tantras have been translated and published? And if so what books are they available in? Partial or complete(by partial I mean a considerable amount, not an excerpt).

I know some are in the Precious Treasury collection by Longchenpa and #12 is translated by Keith Dowman in his book Old Man Basking In The Sun but does anyone know about any of the others? There's a few titles associated with each listed.

1. Natural Arising of Awareness (rig pa rang shar)
Great Tantra of Self-Arising Awareness (rig pa rang shar chen po'i rgyud)
Rangshar Tantra (rang shar gyi rgyud)

2. Mirror of the Heart of Vajrasattva (rdo rje sems dpa' snying gi me long)

3. Lion's Perfect Expressive Power (seng ge rtsal rdzogs),
Tantra of the Perfected Lion (seng ge rtsal rdzogs kyi rgyud)

4. Absence of Letters (yi ge med pa),
Letterless Tantra and/or Tantra of No Letters (yi ge med pa'i rgyud)

5. Beauteous Good Auspices (bkra shis mdzes ldan),
Tantra of Graceful Auspiciousness (bkra shis mdzes ldan gyi rgyud),
Tantra of Great Auspicious Beauty (bkra shis mdzes ldan chen po'i rgyud)

6. Penetration of Sound (sgra thal 'gyur),
Dra Talgyur Root Tantra (sgra thal 'gyur rtsa ba'i rgyud)

7. Mirror of the Heart of Samantabhadra (kun tu bzang po thugs kyi me long),
Tantra of Samantabhadra's Mind Mirror (kun bzang thugs kyi me long gi rgyud)

8. Blazing Lamp (sgron ma 'bar ba),
Blazing Lamp Tantra and/or Tantra of the Radiant Lamp (sgron ma 'bar ba'i rgyud)

9. Studded Jewels (nor bu bkra bkod),
Array of Fine Gemstones and/or Norbu Trako (nor bu 'phra bkod),
Tantra of Studded Jewels (nor bu phra bkod kyi rgyud)

10. Coalescence of Sun and Moon and/or Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor),
Tantra of the Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor gyi rgyud)

11. Pearl Necklace (mu tig phreng ba),
Pearl Garland Tantra (mu tig phreng ba'i rgyud) and/or (mu tig 'phreng ba'i rgyud)

12. Natural Liberation of Awareness (rig pa rang grol),
Tantra of Self-liberated Awareness (rig pa rang grol gyi rgyud)

13. The Six Spheres (klong drug; klong drug pa)
or Sixfold Expanse (klong drug gi rgyud)
or Six Spheres of Samantabhadra (kun tu bzang po klong drug pa'i rgyud)

14. Naturally Born Perfection (rdzogs pa rang byung) and/or Self-Existing Perfection

15. Black Wrathful Goddess (nag mo khros ma); referring to a black form of Vajrayogini (khros ma nag mo)

16. Blazing Relics of the Buddha-Body (sku gdung 'bar ba),
Tantra of Shining Relics (sku gdung 'bar ba'i rgyud)

17. Mound of Gemstones (rin chen spungs),
Tantra of the Jewel Mound and/or Tantra of Piled Gems (rin chen spungs pa'i rgyud)
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby heart » Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:47 pm

asunthatneversets wrote:Which of the 17 Dzogchen tantras have been translated and published? And if so what books are they available in? Partial or complete(by partial I mean a considerable amount, not an excerpt).

I know some are in the Precious Treasury collection by Longchenpa and #12 is translated by Keith Dowman in his book Old Man Basking In The Sun but does anyone know about any of the others? There's a few titles associated with each listed.



#12 is not in the "gnas lugs mdzod" except a few quotes. I prefer Richard Barron's translation of "gnas lugs mdzod" anyway. To my knowledge there are no translations except Jean-Luc Achard's translations to french.

/magnus
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Sönam » Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:21 pm

heart wrote:
asunthatneversets wrote:Which of the 17 Dzogchen tantras have been translated and published? And if so what books are they available in? Partial or complete(by partial I mean a considerable amount, not an excerpt).

I know some are in the Precious Treasury collection by Longchenpa and #12 is translated by Keith Dowman in his book Old Man Basking In The Sun but does anyone know about any of the others? There's a few titles associated with each listed.



#12 is not in the "gnas lugs mdzod" except a few quotes. I prefer Richard Barron's translation of "gnas lugs mdzod" anyway. To my knowledge there are no translations except Jean-Luc Achard's translations to french.

/magnus


and Philippe Cornu for "2. Mirror of the Heart of Vajrasattva (rdo rje sems dpa' snying gi me long)" ... Le Miroir du Coeur de Vajrasattva - Editions du Seuil

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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby udawa » Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:35 pm

10. Coalescence of Sun and Moon and/or Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor),
Tantra of the Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor gyi rgyud)

I think I'm right in saying that part of 10 has been translated into English by Giacomella Orofino, as The Tantra of the Great Secret Union of the Sun and Moon in the book 'Sacred Tibetan Teachings On Death and Liberation, Prism Press 1999.

D
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Pero » Wed Feb 29, 2012 6:57 pm

udawa wrote:10. Coalescence of Sun and Moon and/or Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor),
Tantra of the Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor gyi rgyud)

I think I'm right in saying that part of 10 has been translated into English by Giacomella Orofino, as The Tantra of the Great Secret Union of the Sun and Moon in the book 'Sacred Tibetan Teachings On Death and Liberation, Prism Press 1999.

D

Do you know/remember how big a part?
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby udawa » Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:21 am

Pero wrote:
udawa wrote:10. Coalescence of Sun and Moon and/or Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor),
Tantra of the Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor gyi rgyud)

I think I'm right in saying that part of 10 has been translated into English by Giacomella Orofino, as The Tantra of the Great Secret Union of the Sun and Moon in the book 'Sacred Tibetan Teachings On Death and Liberation, Prism Press 1999.

D

Do you know/remember how big a part?


From memory, it's the second part, dealing with the bardo of dying etc. The translation of this part is possibly 15 pages (just a guess)? The whole book is a fairly modest paperback and includes translations of two other works, one from the Bon tradition. The Sun and Moon is the most substantial. The Tibetan texts are included in an appendix.

I'll see if I can track down my copy later.
Edwards: You are a philosopher. Dr Johnson: I have tried too in my time to be a philosopher; but, I don't know how, cheerfulness was always breaking in.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby udawa » Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:38 am

udawa wrote:
Pero wrote:
udawa wrote:10. Coalescence of Sun and Moon and/or Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor),
Tantra of the Union of Sun and Moon (nyi zla kha sbyor gyi rgyud)

I think I'm right in saying that part of 10 has been translated into English by Giacomella Orofino, as The Tantra of the Great Secret Union of the Sun and Moon in the book 'Sacred Tibetan Teachings On Death and Liberation, Prism Press 1999.

D

Do you know/remember how big a part?


From memory, it's the second part, dealing with the bardo of dying etc. The translation of this part is possibly 15 pages (just a guess)? The whole book is a fairly modest paperback and includes translations of two other works, one from the Bon tradition. The Sun and Moon is the most substantial. The Tibetan texts are included in an appendix.

I'll see if I can track down my copy later.


OK, found it. The extract is pages 204 - 233 of the Tibetan text as set out here http://wikisource.org/wiki/Nyi_ma_dang_zla_ba_kha_sbyor_ba_chen_po_gsang_ba%27i_rgyud

The translation takes up about 20 pages, and covers the third and fourth chapters.

Hope that helps
Edwards: You are a philosopher. Dr Johnson: I have tried too in my time to be a philosopher; but, I don't know how, cheerfulness was always breaking in.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Anubodha » Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:34 am

There is also a nice translation of a chapter of the Lion's Perfected Display (Senge rtsal rdzogs) by Janet Gyatso in Buddhist Scriptures, pp. 488-494, ed. by D. Lopez.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Pero » Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:15 pm

udawa wrote:
udawa wrote:
Pero wrote:Do you know/remember how big a part?


From memory, it's the second part, dealing with the bardo of dying etc. The translation of this part is possibly 15 pages (just a guess)? The whole book is a fairly modest paperback and includes translations of two other works, one from the Bon tradition. The Sun and Moon is the most substantial. The Tibetan texts are included in an appendix.

I'll see if I can track down my copy later.


OK, found it. The extract is pages 204 - 233 of the Tibetan text as set out here http://wikisource.org/wiki/Nyi_ma_dang_zla_ba_kha_sbyor_ba_chen_po_gsang_ba%27i_rgyud

The translation takes up about 20 pages, and covers the third and fourth chapters.

Hope that helps

Thanks, might get a used copy.
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
- Shabkar
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Bj Lhundrup » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:07 pm

So has anyone seen a Tibetan printing of just the 17 root tantras together. Not Tarthang Rinpoche's though because its got mistakes and not so good paper. I'll be useing for Zung-juk so we need a good printer version. Other wise I have to go through the Gyud-bum and pull them all out.

Any help or Info
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Yudron » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:14 pm

Jim Valby was kind enough to send me a CD of the 17 main Dzogchen tantras input into Wylie. My intention is to eventually use Tibet doc to change them into u-chen. I have not proofed any against the original yet.

I really appreciate his generosity.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Malcolm » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:23 pm

Yudron wrote:Jim Valby was kind enough to send me a CD of the 17 main Dzogchen tantras input into Wylie. My intention is to eventually use Tibet doc to change them into u-chen. I have not proofed any against the original yet.

I really appreciate his generosity.



Generally speaking I use the Adzom Chogar recension for convenience, but I have found that in many respects the Tsham Brag recension of the 17 to be more accurate, at least when it comes to comparing root text with commentaries.
Last edited by Malcolm on Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Yudron » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:29 pm

Malcolm wrote:
Yudron wrote:Jim Valby was kind enough to send me a CD of the 17 main Dzogchen tantras input into Wylie. My intention is to eventually use Tibet doc to change them into u-chen. I have not proofed any against the original yet.

I really appreciate his generosity.



Generally speaking I use the Adzom Chogar recension for convenience, but I have found that many respects the Tsham Brag recensionof the 17 to be more accurate, at least when it comes to comparing root text with commentaries.


Thanks! I'm really in over my head here: I don't know what the tsham brag edition is. Is that on TBRC?

I was assuming they were in the nyingma gyud bum.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Malcolm » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:37 pm

Yudron wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
Yudron wrote:Jim Valby was kind enough to send me a CD of the 17 main Dzogchen tantras input into Wylie. My intention is to eventually use Tibet doc to change them into u-chen. I have not proofed any against the original yet.

I really appreciate his generosity.



Generally speaking I use the Adzom Chogar recension for convenience, but I have found that many respects the Tsham Brag recensionof the 17 to be more accurate, at least when it comes to comparing root text with commentaries.


Thanks! I'm really in over my head here: I don't know what the tsham brag edition is. Is that on TBRC?

I was assuming they were in the nyingma gyud bum.


There are three Nyingma rgyud 'bums: Ting skyes, Tsham brag and Derge (Adzom Chogar).

The first two share a common root, and the last is a separate tradition.

IN reality, you need all three. For example, the Rig pa rang shar version found in the Derge lineage was collated out of three manuscript traditions, and all three are represented here in the mchan 'grel i.e interlineal notes. These notes are absent from the first two collections of tantras.

I am presently working on translating all 17 tantras into English. When they are published, if they are published, it is quite likely I shall insist that they can only be made available to those people who have received at minimum either the Vima Nyinthig or Khandro Nyingthig empowerments or equivalents, and the complete lung for the seventeen tantras themselves. They will also cost a lot of money. Please do not ask me for them, I am not presently distributing them to anyone so I will just ignore you.

M
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Yudron » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:45 pm

I salute your noble intention!

I think I have only the Derge edition, so it is good to know I need to collect the other two. My only experience with the NGB was trying to look at one of the tantras associated with the spyi ti, which I found to be very illegible. But my reading level is low, so I can imagined that fluent people could figure it out better.
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Pero » Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:53 pm

Malcolm wrote:When they are published, if they are published, it is quite likely I shall insist that they can only be made available to those people who have received at minimum either the Vima Nyinthig or Khandro Nyingthig empowerments or equivalents, and the complete lung for the seventeen tantras themselves.

:cry:
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Pero » Sun Sep 02, 2012 11:02 pm

What are the equivalents BTW?
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby arsent » Mon Sep 03, 2012 5:36 am

Malcolm wrote:I am presently working on translating all 17 tantras into English. When they are published, if they are published, it is quite likely I shall insist that they can only be made available to those people who have received at minimum either the Vima Nyinthig or Khandro Nyingthig empowerments or equivalents, and the complete lung for the seventeen tantras themselves. They will also cost a lot of money. Please do not ask me for them, I am not presently distributing them to anyone so I will just ignore you.



Great information anyway!
One more reason to start study Tibetan myself.. :reading:
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby heart » Mon Sep 03, 2012 5:38 am

Malcolm wrote:
I am presently working on translating all 17 tantras into English. When they are published, if they are published, it is quite likely I shall insist that they can only be made available to those people who have received at minimum either the Vima Nyinthig or Khandro Nyingthig empowerments or equivalents, and the complete lung for the seventeen tantras themselves. They will also cost a lot of money. Please do not ask me for them, I am not presently distributing them to anyone so I will just ignore you.

M


That is wonderful Malcolm. Please get a good editor to work closely with, I know you know at least one that is very skilled and experienced. I will pray for the successful fulfillment of your intentions. Sarva mangalam!

/magnus
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- Longchenpa
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Re: Which Of The 17 Dzogchen Tantras Have Been Published?

Postby Sönam » Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:52 am

heart wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
I am presently working on translating all 17 tantras into English. When they are published, if they are published, it is quite likely I shall insist that they can only be made available to those people who have received at minimum either the Vima Nyinthig or Khandro Nyingthig empowerments or equivalents, and the complete lung for the seventeen tantras themselves. They will also cost a lot of money. Please do not ask me for them, I am not presently distributing them to anyone so I will just ignore you.

M


That is wonderful Malcolm. Please get a good editor to work closely with, I know you know at least one that is very skilled and experienced. I will pray for the successful fulfillment of your intentions. Sarva mangalam!

/magnus


:twothumbsup:
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By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
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