Dharma Wheel

A Buddhist discussion forum on Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism
It is currently Mon Dec 22, 2014 1:06 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:42 pm
Posts: 493
If one is on the Dzogchen path how does one concretely deal with the loss of a loved one? What view is adopted? what practice? Any help with this will be much appreciated.

_________________
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm
Posts: 1565
Hey Fa,
Song of Vajra would be my first choice.
Wishing you well with whatever is going on.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 5:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 9:19 pm
Posts: 612
Location: Lafayette, CO
Dear Fa Dao,

Sorry about your (implied) loss. In dealing with your own grief, threk-chod. Things that can benefit the departed:

Phowa as soon after death as possible
Ne-dren (Chang-chog, i.e., leading the departed out of the six realms) beginning after three days and done either daily or every seven days after death for 49 days
Bardo prayers
Sur Chod for "feeding" those in the bardo, especially every evening
Zang Chod Monlam
Manis
Vajrasattvas
Narak Kong-shak
Any virtuous act whose merit is dedicated to the departed (candles, water offerings, flowers, food offerings, ganachakras, circumabulations, etc., etc.)

Send me a PM with the departed's name and date of death and I will include him/her in my prayers. I am currently in retreat doing a Pegyal Lingpa Red Vajrasattva/Shi-tro sadhana. So very apropos. I will keep you in my prayers as well.

Sincerely,

Lama Gyawo

_________________
Pema Chophel པདྨ་ཆོས་འཕེལ


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:42 pm
Posts: 493
Thank you all very much for your help.

_________________
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 9:51 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2011 6:26 pm
Posts: 639
Location: Mudhole? Slimy? My home, this is.
Shitro.

_________________
. . . there they saw a rock! But it wasn't a rock . . .


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:19 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:57 pm
Posts: 5
Shitro


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:23 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:36 am
Posts: 4027
Location: Spaceship Earth
Shitro
Avalokiteshvara Korwa Tongtrug

_________________
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 7:43 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 6:57 am
Posts: 74
Hey friend. Maybe think about the view you already have and apply the dharma to it.
Loss of loved ones is a very strong reminder of impermanence.
Seeing someone lose a precious human birth is a strong motivator for bodhicitta.
Feeling the pain of personal loss is a strong fuel for tonglen.
Dzogchen's not so good at fixing things, if you catch my drift.

Wishing you peace.
YG


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:17 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:42 pm
Posts: 493
Yontan,
the question wasnt about trying to fix anything, just understand it from a Dzogchen view and see what practices aided in that.

_________________
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:19 am
Posts: 1030
Location: Southern Oregon
From the Dzogchen POV, I think one could say that birth, life, and death are likened to seemingly separate permutations within a single dream. When one recognizes one's true nature and the nature of all things, one recognizes that there is no actual birth/arising, life/abiding, or death/dissolution to any phenomenon. If this is realized in a very direct, actual way, it's undoubtedly liberating. But for those of us whose understanding is more intellectual, thinking about it that way may or may not help with the pain of loss. I suppose it could for some, if their intuitive provisional understanding of this were particularly strong... But for most, relative level practices such that might assist their departed loved one find a favorable rebirth might be of more immediate consolation than Dzogchen perse until and unless one really has discovered rigpa.

One thing that is a major consolation and help for me when losing people I care about is the neydren ritual that takes place once a year here at Tashi Choling. Neydren basically means "hooking" the consciousness of the deceased person and directing it to a buddha's pure realm, and this can be done regardless of how recently the person died or any other factors I can think of (though it's only ever done once per individual). If possible, one uses a photo or hair or ashes, or a piece of some unwashed item of clothing belonging to the deceased as a support. Some great master such as HH Getse Rinpoche, Yangthang Tulku Rinpoche, Lingtrul Rinpoche or another acts as Vajramaster and is the one performing this in actuality, though the whole sangha of practitioners practices along. The neydren is held every year around July during Tashi Choling's annual Dudjom Tersar Vajrasattva retreat and items to be used as a support can be mailed in if one can't attend. Also, the ashes of all these supports (which are burned during the ritual) are used in the end to make Amitabha tsa tsa's which are then placed in Tashi Choling's Amitabha shrine. Here's a link to last year's neydren flyer: http://www.tashicholing.org/pdfs/neydre ... 202010.pdf

It seems to me I'd heard in the past that some other Nyingma centers also do neydren annually, so if anyone's interested, it's something that you can look into. This may be practiced outside Nyingma but I don't know. I do know that in the past when a loved one had died, the ability to include him or her in this ritual has been a great consolation to me.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:14 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm
Posts: 1565
Fa Dao wrote:
Yontan,
the question wasnt about trying to fix anything, just understand it from a Dzogchen view and see what practices aided in that.

Hey Fa,
You should get the mp3's of Rinpoche's teaching on the Song of Vajra if you dont have it already.
He goes in to a lot of detail in one of the sessions about how the SOV can be used to create a positive cause for others through sensory contact.
I think the SOV can definitely benefit others.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:54 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:42 pm
Posts: 493
Pema Rigdzin-VERY helpful..thank you

Nangwa-yes, I do have that. Thank you for reminding me about that section. Perfect.

_________________
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:53 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:19 am
Posts: 1030
Location: Southern Oregon
:namaste:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Loss of a loved one
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 2:18 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:57 pm
Posts: 5
Paramita of Compassion


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] 

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: qwerty13, Saoshun and 11 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group