ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Pero » Wed Feb 08, 2012 9:52 pm

Fa Dao wrote:Rinpoche is always saying that it is important to know the meaning/purpose of doing a particular practice. So, while I caught the part on how to do it I did not catch the part on the why. I feel a strong connection to this practice and have very little idea what its for other than the obvious basic that it is similar to Guru Tragphur and Simhamukha for clearing obstacles. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.

Next to clearing obstacles, well, you know, achieving enlightenment. :tongue:
Seriously, it doesn't say anything else in the explanation of the essence of Dorje Drolo.
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Fa Dao » Wed Feb 08, 2012 10:25 pm

Thanks Pero,
LOL, of course I didnt mention the enlightenment reason as I figured that was a given. However, I dont remember where but I thought I remembered reading somewhere that it was good if ones obstacles took the form of extreme emotional mood swings or something like that. Oh well...
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby alpha » Wed Feb 08, 2012 11:13 pm

Namdrol wrote:

Drollo practice can cause lots of obstacles.


Is it because this kind of practice leads to an intensification of strong emotions ,anger,hatred..etc..?
And also is it that because they become more apparent and readily available(these emotions) would make resting in rigpa much more easy ???
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:06 am

alpha wrote:
Namdrol wrote:

Drollo practice can cause lots of obstacles.


Is it because this kind of practice leads to an intensification of strong emotions ,anger,hatred..etc..?
And also is it that because they become more apparent and readily available(these emotions) would make resting in rigpa much more easy ???



It is because this practice has a lot to do with pacifying the wildest of the eight classes. This is why one should only do the action mantra with a very light touch.
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Fa Dao » Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:25 am

It is because this practice has a lot to do with pacifying the wildest of the eight classes. This is why one should only do the action mantra with a very light touch.

Namdrol, would you mind explaining this? I already have enough problems/obstacles as it is without screwing myself up more. If you cant go into more detail in open forum could you please PM me. Unfortunately I apparently missed some important pieces. Maybe this practice is just for more advanced practitioners and I am in over my head its just that the little I have been able to do so far (doing it in the short tun) I like the feeling of. Havent even tried the action mantra yet...would be good to know exactly what the action mantra is used for.
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:43 am

Fa Dao wrote:
It is because this practice has a lot to do with pacifying the wildest of the eight classes. This is why one should only do the action mantra with a very light touch.

Namdrol, would you mind explaining this? I already have enough problems/obstacles as it is without screwing myself up more. If you cant go into more detail in open forum could you please PM me. Unfortunately I apparently missed some important pieces. Maybe this practice is just for more advanced practitioners and I am in over my head its just that the little I have been able to do so far (doing it in the short tun) I like the feeling of. Havent even tried the action mantra yet...would be good to know exactly what the action mantra is used for.



Basically, Drolo is very powerful. But obviously now is the time for Drolo practice in the DC.

Drolo is used for overcoming obstacles. Also it is a complete path.

Rinpoche has mentioned that even doing such peaceful practices as Sang can sometimes caused problems if you do them in a distracted way.

Rinpoche really emphasized quality over quantity, as he often does.

But in the end, ChNN would not have taught the practice if he did not feel people could not handle it.

Just treat it with awareness.
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འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

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there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby padma norbu » Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:00 am

Are the sort of obstacles generally like highlighting your major weaknesses? Seems logical that these obstacles would just be like "here's your problem, here's your problem, here's your problem, here's your problem..." so you get the point quicker: HEY! THIS IS MY PROBLEM! And then you can deal with it?
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:02 am

padma norbu wrote:Are the sort of obstacles generally like highlighting your major weaknesses? Seems logical that these obstacles would just be like "here's your problem, here's your problem, here's your problem, here's your problem..." so you get the point quicker: HEY! THIS IS MY PROBLEM! And then you can deal with it?



The sort of obstacles that happen are things sometimes seem not to work out right, things that challenge your integration and your ability to relax.
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འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Fa Dao » Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:07 am

Thanks..I really do feel a lot better now. Its just that there have been so many posts in this thread about going crazy etc..had me a little freaked out. I dont know a lot but I know not to screw around with this stuff.
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:23 am

Fa Dao wrote:Thanks..I really do feel a lot better now. Its just that there have been so many posts in this thread about going crazy etc..had me a little freaked out. I dont know a lot but I know not to screw around with this stuff.



crazy |ˈkrāzē| informal

adjective ( crazier , craziest )

1) To lack integration and awareness

2) To be distracted by tension

3) Wisdom
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Fa Dao » Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:39 am

See, thats been the problem lately. It has been difficult to follow Rinpoches instructions on relaxing, being Present, and doing Guru Yoga etc. Keep running into weird shit/obstacles/problems/illnesses. Perhaps I should take a few days and do this practice for both quality and quantity.
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:14 am

Fa Dao wrote:See, thats been the problem lately. It has been difficult to follow Rinpoches instructions on relaxing, being Present, and doing Guru Yoga etc. Keep running into weird shit/obstacles/problems/illnesses. Perhaps I should take a few days and do this practice for both quality and quantity.



That also can help. Remember what he said about mixiing it up though...pick a few practices, like Mandarava and drollo combined. Rushan and drollo, etc.
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འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Pema Rigdzin » Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:46 am

Out of curosity, Namdrol, given your preference for pronouncing mantras as closely to the Sanskrit as possible, do you personally say "Drowo" or "Krowo"? I ask because I've taken to trying to stay more faithful to the Sanskrit too, but Drollod's name seems to have been so thoroughly Tibetanized that it bears so little resemblance to its properly Sanskrit version.
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:49 am

Pema Rigdzin wrote:Out of curosity, Namdrol, given your preference for pronouncing mantras as closely to the Sanskrit as possible, do you personally say "Drowo" or "Krowo"? I ask because I've taken to trying to stay more faithful to the Sanskrit too, but Drollod's name seems to have been so thoroughly Tibetanized that it bears so little resemblance to its properly Sanskrit version.



gro bo lot is a Apabhramsa corruption of krodhalokottara according to Situ Panchen. In Sanskrit then, it means "transcendentally wrathful".

I pronunce it as Rinpoche does.
Last edited by Malcolm on Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Fa Dao » Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:49 am

Remember what he said about mixiing it up though...pick a few practices, like Mandarava and drollo combined. Rushan and drollo, etc.

Got it...will do...thanks again man
"But if you know how to observe yourself, you will discover your real nature, the primordial state, the state of Guruyoga, and then all will become clear because you will have discovered everything"-Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Lhug-Pa » Thu Feb 09, 2012 3:27 am

Is there any benefit in having the Lung for Dorje Drolo without the Donwang?

If there is any benefit for having the Lung only, how would it be applied?
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 3:35 am

Lhug-Pa wrote:Is there any benefit in having the Lung for Dorje Drolo without the Donwang?

If there is any benefit for having the Lung only, how would it be applied?



Yes, and you would recite the mantra etc.
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འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Lhug-Pa » Thu Feb 09, 2012 4:03 am

Thanks. So then we could incorporate Dorje Drolo in the Tun practice with the Lung only as well?
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby Malcolm » Thu Feb 09, 2012 4:06 am

Lhug-Pa wrote:Thanks. So then we could incorporate Dorje Drolo in the Tun practice with the Lung only as well?


Indeed.
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http://www.bhaisajya.guru
http://atikosha.org
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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Re: ChNNR Dorje Drolo retreat

Postby padma norbu » Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:27 pm

Honestly, I think the practices I've been doing have created obstacles already. I thought I was just being paranoid before, but now I'm relatively certain this must be the case.

For a while, when obstacles seemed to be increasing, I kept remembering this one DC member's words when I first started going to Kundrolling: "Dzogchen is not an easy path." She said this like 2 or 3 times upon first being introduced to me while she was rummaging around, almost like a mother or something. Actually, I thought, "well, she's annoying, isn't she? What's with the 'Debbie Downer' routine?" I remember wondering why she was saying that and being slightly worried about getting involved because of it, as I looked around at the rest of the members: an old lady was twitching, some of the other members just looked like hapless individuals... It was really a memorable moment where it seemed like a clear warning. I considered running for the hills, but instead decided, "Well, she's annoying. I won't let her discourage me."
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