Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby lelopa » Thu Dec 26, 2013 8:00 am

the practice-text is available at the webcast-site - pretty short
I do not have any solutions - but i admire the problems!
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Tenpa » Fri Dec 27, 2013 3:54 pm

What is the specific use/function of this Kalachakra Atiyoga practice?
tks.
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Malcolm » Fri Dec 27, 2013 4:19 pm

Tenpa wrote:What is the specific use/function of this Kalachakra Atiyoga practice?
tks.



Total realization. Might improve your astrological skills too.
http://www.bhaisajya.net
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Virgo » Fri Dec 27, 2013 4:57 pm

How much is my limitation? If I missed the first day and listened to it on replay I did not receive the lung for the ganapuja to be done after donwong, do then I have missed my opportunity for this?

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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Malcolm » Fri Dec 27, 2013 5:04 pm

Virgo wrote:How much is my limitation? If I missed the first day and listened to it on replay I did not receive the lung for the ganapuja to be done after donwong, do then I have missed my opportunity for this?

Kevin



He gave it again today.
http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://atikosha.org
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

" The one who teaches the benefits of peace,
he is said to be a ṛṣī; the others are the opposite of him."

-- Uttaratantra
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Virgo » Fri Dec 27, 2013 5:10 pm

Malcolm wrote:
Virgo wrote:How much is my limitation? If I missed the first day and listened to it on replay I did not receive the lung for the ganapuja to be done after donwong, do then I have missed my opportunity for this?

Kevin



He gave it again today.

Ok thanks Loppon. Because of my situation with work I was going to listen to the first sessions on replay and just attend the Donwang live. I am just getting caught up with today's now.

My schedule at work is inconsistent, so it makes retreats hard to attend fully with the different days and times that I must work.

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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby heart » Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:25 pm

Interesting that Rinpoche is calling the Longsal Kalachekra Ati and Changchub Dorje's Kalachakra Anu. Or did I misunderstand?

/magnus
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Malcolm » Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:28 pm

heart wrote:Interesting that Rinpoche is calling the Longsal Kalachekra Ati and Changchub Dorje's Kalachakra Anu. Or did I misunderstand?

/magnus



No, you did not misunderstand.
http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://atikosha.org
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

" The one who teaches the benefits of peace,
he is said to be a ṛṣī; the others are the opposite of him."

-- Uttaratantra
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Virgo » Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:10 am

Tenpa wrote:What is the specific use/function of this Kalachakra Atiyoga practice?
tks.

You can gain access to answers of questions such as,

"If I mix belladonna, aconite, hemlock, henbane,
thornapple, cinquefoil, and mandragora, and soak them in brandy made by Christian monks, then take it on the full moon day, will I be able to race across the astral planes on a demon steed"?

Is that the kind of thing you wished to know about?

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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Virgo » Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:31 pm

Virgo wrote: race across the astral planes..

Actually, just kidding. :smile:

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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby billzoe » Sun Dec 29, 2013 6:59 am

heart wrote:Interesting that Rinpoche is calling the Longsal Kalachekra Ati and Changchub Dorje's Kalachakra Anu. Or did I misunderstand?

/magnus



Yes, Saturdays Longsal topic was interesting on this. Thats what i heard too. I guess one main difference (that we can say on forum) is if my capacity is not up to par (common for me, Rinpoche would probably recommend Guru Yoga for this issue, but i am not so good with discipline!), the Anu one may work better at that time. If ones capacity is awesome, use the Ati gate - just guessing. Although Ati transcends Kala, Kala is so very interesting too, esp. the ties into the paranormal stuff of Shambhala, Dewa Sangpo, Dolpopa, Gesar, ZZ Bon (Changchub taught CNNr and Shardza!), etc... :twothumbsup:
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby billzoe » Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:25 pm

Tenpa wrote:What is the specific use/function of this Kalachakra Atiyoga practice?
tks.



Seems to be to provide Anu and/or Ati (whichever works best for you) access to Kalachakra lineage and its specific facets. CNNr mentions the original lineage holder Dawa Sangpo as this (Shakyamuni transmitted it first to Dawa Sangpo). I have read that it came from Shambhala and that Shambhala predates Shakyamuni by thousands of years. CNNr talks on this briefly on day 1's talk.

The purpose of Kalachakra was originally to be a Anu/Vajrayana gate for lay persons i think (ie: Dawa Sangpo, a King who wanted to stay in power vs. become a monk). Nowadays i have heard it described as a BRIDGE between Anu/Ati and the mundane world of lay persons, who often have a gap between the 2 (even though there are no "2", if we dont realize that, we may need to bridge it or Anu/Ati may suffer).

Also i have heard this issue descibed as "Tantrika neurosis" by Trungpa Rinpoche, and a low Life Force plague of western/modern society (or in India during the Hordes)-if ones lifeforce is low, your Anu-Ati Capacity will be faulty, this ties in with all the appearances of "Barbarians" in the Shambhala saga (and in the relative world, this is plainly obvious nowadays). In the Jonang Kalachakra, the life force issue is part of the 6 Completion yogas. I am guessing it is includued here by default (?). This is related to Lungta also.

There is also the sense that Samsara and society can somehow be uplifted, and this differs from traditional Buddhism that says this cannot be done, Samsara can only be vacated (or all beings liberated), in Shambhala it appears both happened, first it became an Enlightened Society, then it vacated into wherever and is still there ! :alien:

Ati Kala hopefully is a simpler potent method !? (that possibly includes much of the LONG Anu facets in it). Rinpoche would probably have to answer this, i dont know-just guessing. IMO its a sweet bridging of Relative world and the Ultimate world [for those of us with not great Ati Capacity], whats the old saying? "The dog poo on my shoe may not really exist but it still smells like sh*t" :thumbsup:
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby In the bone yard » Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:44 pm

Hi billzoe,

I think the difference in the tantras are the level of realization.
Realizations on the path are Form Body 'achievements'.
If you aren't on the path I wouldn't try to figure it out...too much distraction for my meditation.
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Zen Dude » Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:10 pm

Michael_Dorfman wrote:
Norwegian wrote:Try contacting your local gar, as well as the webcast team.


Success! Contacting the webcast team directly did the trick. Seems obvious in retrospect, but most good tips do, I suppose.


http://www.reddit.com/r/Buddhism/comments/1txilp/rip_umichael_dorfman_stalwart_of_rbuddhism_who/

RIP Michael.
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Pero » Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:25 pm

Zen Dude wrote:
Michael_Dorfman wrote:
Norwegian wrote:Try contacting your local gar, as well as the webcast team.


Success! Contacting the webcast team directly did the trick. Seems obvious in retrospect, but most good tips do, I suppose.


http://www.reddit.com/r/Buddhism/comments/1txilp/rip_umichael_dorfman_stalwart_of_rbuddhism_who/

RIP Michael.

Wow................. This is just shocking. :(
I will remember him in my practice.
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby padma norbu » Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:20 pm

:jawdrop: That's just terrible news! Wow. And what timing.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Pero » Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:23 pm

padma norbu wrote::jawdrop: That's just terrible news! Wow. And what timing.

What's so shocking to me is that he seems to have commited suicide the same day he posted his last message here...
I just don't get it. :(
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby padma norbu » Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:26 pm

Pero wrote:
padma norbu wrote::jawdrop: That's just terrible news! Wow. And what timing.

What's so shocking to me is that he seems to have commited suicide the same day he posted his last message here...
I just don't get it. :(


He committed suicide?!? I didn't read that. Holy crap. He pmed me asking if he could use my user/pass for the Kalacakra webcast since I wasn't using it and I said "they ask us not to do that" and gave him the email for the webcast people. I see that he said he had "success" but I hope he wasn't just saying that so nobody would feel bad. It seems to me like he really wanted to attend this kalacakra retreat and maybe was not able to before he chose to go. :crying:
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Norwegian » Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:30 pm

That is tragic. And very unfortunate...
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Re: Kalachakra in Dzogchen Community

Postby Pero » Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:35 pm

padma norbu wrote:
Pero wrote:
padma norbu wrote::jawdrop: That's just terrible news! Wow. And what timing.

What's so shocking to me is that he seems to have commited suicide the same day he posted his last message here...
I just don't get it. :(


He committed suicide?!? I didn't read that. Holy crap.

It seems so.
https://www.facebook.com/michael.dorfman.127?fref=ts wrote: This is a message from the family of Michael Dorfman.

We have very sad news for his friends.
Tragically Michael ended his life on December 25th
The funeral will take place in Florø Norway on Friday January 3rd.
Tributes can be sent with a personal message to Dag Frøyen or email dag.nesbo.froyen at enivest.net

I say seems because it could be just that the person writting this isn't aware what "ended his life" implies in English.

He pmed me asking if he could use my user/pass for the Kalacakra webcast since I wasn't using it and I said "they ask us not to do that" and gave him the email for the webcast people. I see that he said he had "success" but I hope he wasn't just saying that so nobody would feel bad. It seems to me like he really wanted to attend this kalacakra retreat and maybe was not able to before he chose to go. :crying:

I don't have that impression at all, which is why it doesn't make sense to me. He seems to have been quite interested in Kalachakra as I got the impression from reading something that he was also intending to go to Ladakh next year when the Dalai Lama will be giving it.
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
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