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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:58 pm 
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gregkavarnos wrote:

Does any of this stuff sound familiar?



Of course, fruit of the paths of Mahāmudra and Dzogchen are the same.

The differences lie in how one is introduced to one's primordial state and the method used for discovering and maintaing that state.

Mahāmudra has very few methods: either the two stages, practicing the four yogas or suddenly awakening, like Saraha.

Dzogchen, by contrast, has a plethora which are adapted to every conceivable capacity of interested persons.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:00 pm 
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Sönam wrote:
No emotions are disturbing, so just relax and stay in your own nature. Emotions are equal in being unborn and not existing anywhere since they have arisen from the unborn state, are dwelling in that state, and cease in it.

"One has to confirm that the appearances are delusions of the mind, and the mind which grasps the appearances is emptiness, like space. ... Space is changeless. ... The meaning of that changelessness is peace and nirvana from primordial time, and it is the nature of Samantabhadra."
- Longchen Rabjam - Shingta Chenpo -

Sönam


Hi Sonam :hi:

Nice to see you here.

Response: of course no emotions are disturbing to the natural state. But they can be very disturbing to the individual. So disturbing, in fact, that the ego function understands implicitly to avoid going into them. I think thats what keeps most people in samsara, preferring the illusions of samsara to the pain of undoing their conditioning. But, as usual, I am just talking about myself here. Not everyone is wired up the same way.

Anyhoo, nice to see you.

Cheers.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:10 pm 
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The question was "how Dzogchen deals with it?" ... that's how it deals with it. It's the path of self-liberation, not the path of transformation.

Sönam

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:31 am 
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mandala wrote:
Yes, I did notice the attached article.

Maybe i missed something though - it seemed to point at mindfulness to observe (and not react to) disturbing emotions - how, exactly, is this a specifically dzogchen practice?


Whether it is or isn't a Dzogchen-specific practice is beside the point, my friend. The issue is its effectiveness. Why is it effective? Because when one sits in mindfulness and observes thoughts, sensations, emotions--including destructive emotions like rage or depression or whatever--during the very moment they arise, mindfulness and simple observation puts us in the moment right before we get carried away, and into, these emotions, etc. and act upon them. It stops the domino effect of thoughts and emotions and actions that normally follow due to lack of mindfulness. Also, simply mindfully observing what arises without doing anything with these movements of mind, we can't help but notice their emptiness. And what are these emotions and thoughts and sensations, but mind? Therefore we see the illusory quality of mind. Then, if we've been directly introduced to natural instant essence, then we can even go beyond merely seeing mind's emptiness: we can also discover its oneness of emptiness and spontaneous presence. This latter stage is the point at which it becomes Dzogchen proper.*

*I don't say Dzogchen here in contradistinction to Mahamudra. I just happen to be speaking on Dzogchen, plus I don't know anything about Mahamudra.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 1:42 pm 
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Thread temporarily closed for a long-overdue cleanup.

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