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 Post subject: breathing meditation
PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:22 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:57 pm
Posts: 4
if i look to breath directly from body i get agitated but if i observe the breath in the mind and not in physical aspect i become relax but after a while i get back to physical sensation of breathing and everything ruined.

the problem is when i look at the breath from the mind, i dont know what do i looking at, is that a sound or shadow of physical sensation or imagination of breathing or just merely knowing of breathing?

i want to stop observing physical breath because it is going to be very un-relax, but how about observing the breath from the mind? is that helpful or i just cultivating a feeling of fogy calm?

i just sat before( i mean just siting, observing mind and posture ), and i think it was helpful but i thought that i need to go a bit more deeper and i turned to breathing, i had the same problem with breathing before and every time i changed that to only sitting.


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 Post subject: Re: breathing meditation
PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 11:26 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:44 pm
Posts: 2230
Hi effort,

Have you received any instruction from a teacher or spiritual friend? I found that very useful when I was first learning how to do "Calm Abiding" meditation :) I learned in a group and met with an instructor one to one.

I am not a teacher, but I would humbly suggest that when you start over-thinking the breathing, simply return to counting the breath. The mind will wander, and then we have to reel it back in. If you give me your general area you live in, perhaps I could help you find a dharma center.

Best,
Drolma


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 Post subject: Re: breathing meditation
PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2009 6:51 pm 
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i'm sure that a good teacher would be really a big help, but i dont have any right now. calm abiding is a really advanced topic, i just want to know is observing the breath from the mind is meaningful for you or not. it is something like observing both mind and breath or observing the breath from the mind or observing the breath from the eye corner instead of directly watch that.


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 Post subject: Re: breathing meditation
PostPosted: Sun Sep 13, 2009 8:41 am 
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effort wrote:
i'm sure that a good teacher would be really a big help, but i dont have any right now. calm abiding is a really advanced topic, i just want to know is observing the breath from the mind is meaningful for you or not. it is something like observing both mind and breath or observing the breath from the mind or observing the breath from the eye corner instead of directly watch that.


Hi effort,

Apologies for bringing up something that's off topic a bit before. When I've counted breaths or watched my breathing, I watched from the mind as you mentioned. If it caused me anxiety or agitation, I would return to counting and focus on the counting until you can go back to watching the breathing. And when you watch the breathing, it's just your normal body human process you're watching. It doesn't sound like you'll have the problem right now of getting too foggy from it.

Does that help at all? For me, watching the breathing doesn't cause me to become overly alert or to feel agitated, it's about just right for me. There is the foggy danger you mentioned for me more than anything. In fact I've fallen asleep sitting up plenty of times :emb But I could imagine how it could go that way and it might trigger anxiety.

I'm totally not a meditation instructor though, so please take this with a grain of salt!! This is just fellow practitioner support :) Please tell us how it goes, after you try returning to the counting when you start to feel the agitation.

Best wishes,
Drolma

Quote:
the problem is when i look at the breath from the mind, i dont know what do i looking at, is that a sound or shadow of physical sensation or imagination of breathing or just merely knowing of breathing?

i want to stop observing physical breath because it is going to be very un-relax, but how about observing the breath from the mind? is that helpful or i just cultivating a feeling of fogy calm?


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 Post subject: Re: breathing meditation
PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:32 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2009 11:54 pm
Posts: 1229
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Greetings Effort,

Do you perhaps have an anxiety disorder of some variety? Often this can account for such feelings during meditation.

Whilst I don't have one myself, any problems with the breath can cause me concern. I have asthma and sometimes when sleeping (only really at times when my asthma is poorly managed) my airways close up, and I wake up, go bolt upright and try to reopen the airways and suck air in. It's a freaky sound actually trying to inhale lots of air when the airways are still narrow and constricted. It can be scary too... knowing how important breath is in sustaining life! Because of this, I can't snorkel without panicking.

Either way, that's a bit of a diversion but perhaps enough for you to identify some kind mental obstance or hindrance behind this problem.

Metta,
Retro. :)

_________________
Live in concord, with mutual appreciation, without disputing, blending like milk and water, viewing each other with kindly eyes

Dhamma Wheel (Theravada forum) * Here Comes Trouble


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 Post subject: Re: breathing meditation
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 11:41 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:44 pm
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retrofuturist wrote:
Greetings Effort,

Do you perhaps have an anxiety disorder of some variety? Often this can account for such feelings during meditation.

Whilst I don't have one myself, any problems with the breath can cause me concern. I have asthma and sometimes when sleeping (only really at times when my asthma is poorly managed) my airways close up, and I wake up, go bolt upright and try to reopen the airways and suck air in. It's a freaky sound actually trying to inhale lots of air when the airways are still narrow and constricted. It can be scary too... knowing how important breath is in sustaining life! Because of this, I can't snorkel without panicking.

Either way, that's a bit of a diversion but perhaps enough for you to identify some kind mental obstance or hindrance behind this problem.

Metta,
Retro. :)


:good:


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