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kalamas sutta - Dhamma Wheel

kalamas sutta

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
befriend
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kalamas sutta

Postby befriend » Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:00 am

Hi everyone,
what is your understanding on the kalamas sutra where buddha says not to believe in anything if it harmful. i see a lot people saying "buddha said do whatever agrees with reason, common sense and is conducive to the welfare for all". but i also see people saying, "dont go by specious reasoning, but do what the wise say". id like to start a thread about everyones understading of this sutta. i personally doubt that the buddha said, follow your common sense and reason. how are we as deluded beings supposed to use our deluded common sense and reason to know what is right and wrong. my gut tells me from reading other suttas and getting a sense of how buddha teaches is that i think buddha said "dont go by common sense, but follow the wise." i mean think about how much terrible things people can justify by using there reason and common sense, animal cruelty, death penalty, abortion...etc.. sorry if this is already a thread. metta, Befriend
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David N. Snyder
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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby David N. Snyder » Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:12 am

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby ground » Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:42 am


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Ben
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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby Ben » Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:55 am

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby alan » Sun Jul 24, 2011 4:24 am

Interesting.
First off, we'll have to agree on the definition of epistemology. As far as I know, Buddha never ventured into this realm. Nothing I've read has supported this idea.

Everyone has their way of understanding this, and most people use it to support their own ideas. We really do not know what he exactly meant, so best to take this as one of those rare parts of the Canon that are not clearly understood. Going to context is always useful in these circumstances. Reading this in context does not support the views I've seen expressed.

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby cooran » Sun Jul 24, 2011 4:32 am

---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Sun Jul 24, 2011 5:16 am

• • • • (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby Akuma » Sun Jul 24, 2011 8:20 am


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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby Jhana4 » Sun Jul 24, 2011 10:48 am

In reading the scriptures, there are two kinds of mistakes:
One mistake is to cling to the literal text and miss the inner principles.
The second mistake is to recognize the principles but not apply them to your own mind, so that you waste time and just make them into causes of entanglement.

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby rowyourboat » Sun Jul 24, 2011 10:13 pm

With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby alan » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:51 am

We have some pretty smart people here! Pleasantly surprised at the quality of these responses. Another reason why DW is the best place for the thinking Buddhist.

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby Jack » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:05 pm

My understanding is that the sutta says pay attention and respect to the wise but they aren't the last word. The Buddha said come and see. He didn't say believe what I say just because I say it. He is saying try out the teachings to see if they work for you or not.

I think this sutta sets out a high standard. Blind faith is the easy way out. The provisional faith taught be the Buddha is the hard way.

jack

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby rowyourboat » Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:43 pm

With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby alan » Tue Jul 26, 2011 4:15 am

This world if full of people who do not think.

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Thales
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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby Thales » Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:41 pm

"Just as the ocean has a single taste, the taste of salt, so this Dhamma and Discipline has a single taste, the taste of release."

~Ud 5.5

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retrofuturist
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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:47 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby mikenz66 » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:38 am


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rowboat
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Re: kalamas sutta

Postby rowboat » Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:02 am

A Look at the Kalama Sutta by Ven. Bhikkhu Bodhi:
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... ay_09.html
Rain soddens what is covered up,
It does not sodden what is open.
Therefore uncover what is covered
That the rain will not sodden it.
Ud 5.5


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