March Against Monsanto

Alleviating worldly suffering along the way.

Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Thu May 23, 2013 4:20 pm

I agree that people get very emotionally invested in what they want to believe and they use their confirmation bias to justify their beliefs. I see this a lot in the world of conspiracy theorists where some even go so far as to say others are "closed minded" because they don't believe in what they do. Then it turns into arguments back and forth about who thinks they believe correctly, circling around for aeons. I think it is sad because it doesn't solve anything and is just a distraction to investigating what the facts are which can lead to possible solutions or at least discussions on how to practically deal with real issues.

Personally, with regard to GMOs and Monsanto, I try to be very careful about where I'm emotionally invested, what I choose to believe, and what the facts are. I'm clearly adamantly anti-Monsanto, but what the top issues for me are the passing of the Monsanto Protection Act, the lack of long term research on the effects of GMOs on humans, the massive power the company has including the deep embedding into governments and lobbying power, specifically in the US and the environmental impacts of corporations like these (and all environmental issues, really).

I'm too stupid to conduct scientific studies, so I must rely on and hope for others to perform more legitimate studies that are unbiased, double-blind, randomized, and peer reviewed. Then I think we are getting somewhere.

Also, I find fascinating in the last few weeks is how many people I know personally, like family members, who have never heard of Monsanto or GMOs.

Here are a few infographics that I find very useful:

Image

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and this website: Non GMO Shopping Guide

The variations of this LOTR meme are some of my favorites:

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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Thu May 23, 2013 5:14 pm

Genetic Roulette

In this documentary, at and before 46:43 they address the abuses and suppression scientists and others who speak out against GMOs endure. From biotech companies funding a lot of the universities to organized campaigns to discredit those scientists who find problems with GMOs to physically beating people who disagree with their corporate agendas.

And it states:

and the list goes on and on (referring to the many studies and scientists being suppressed and abused by the corporations)

IRINA ERMAKOVA, PhD

Reported that most offspring of female rats fed GM soy died within three weeks. She was publicly attacked and discredited, and ordered to stop research.

Professor G. E. SERALINI, PhD

Found that rats fed Roundup Ready corn for 24 months suffered from massive tumors, premature deaths, and severe organ damage. Although Russia immediately banned GM corn, the attacks on Seralini and the data suppressed the impact of the research elsewhere.


Although they don't mention what the specificity of the attacks were nor do they have sources of "the data suppressed the impact of the research elsewhere.", I have heard other stories of these sorts of things on podcasts, where someone will publicly speak out against GMOs or Monsanto and will be harassed everywhere they go (airports, etc).

The documentary also makes a good point about how hard it is to get the GM seeds to do testing because the biotech companies withhold the seeds, not giving them away to researchers and instead doing their own research with the seeds to manipulate the studies in order to fit their own agendas.
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby greentara » Fri May 24, 2013 12:28 am

Roland, " the lack of long term research on the effects of GMOs on humans, the massive power the company has including the deep embedding into governments and lobbying power, specifically in the US and the environmental impacts of corporations like these (and all environmental issues, really).

I'm too stupid to conduct scientific studies, so I must rely on and hope for others to perform more legitimate studies that are unbiased, double-blind, randomized, and peer reviewed. Then I think we are getting somewhere.

Also, I find fascinating in the last few weeks is how many people I know personally, like family members, who have never heard of Monsanto or GMOs"

I couldn't agree more. I also received an email the other day from an old friend asking in all seriousness ' who or what is Monsanto?'

No one want to be alarmist but it's dangerous to be asleep at the wheel. The truth being we are not the driver instead the huge corporations are at the wheel!
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Azidonis » Sun May 26, 2013 4:19 pm

So... how'd the march go?
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Johnny Dangerous » Sun May 26, 2013 8:19 pm

Dan74 wrote:I am sorry, folks, I appreciate the good intentions and in many ways I share them, but I confess to being dismayed by the blurred lines between fact and fiction that seem to be acceptable here.

I mean if we truly are to battle the unscrupulous mega-corporations, do we make up our lies to counter their lies, or do we rely on integrity and fact? The Seralini study on the effect of GM maise has been rejected by six French national academies and repudiated by the journal that had originally accepted it. He based it on 10 rats of the species that are anyway prone to cancer. There were many other irregularities. This is common knowledge.

The Wakefield study has been exposed as fraud.

Of course there are folks who are emotionally invested in believing certain things who will not listen even if Seralini and Wakefield tell them personally that they don't believe their conclusions, but will rationalise it somehow as the global pharma ploy to brainwash them somehow. But for the open-minded folks, I suggest you listen to people like Raj Patel, whose Stuffed and Starved provides not only plenty of ammunition against Monsanto & Co but also points to the way forward.

http://www.amazon.com/Stuffed-Starved-Hidden-Battle-System/dp/1933633492

It's not laced with simple-minded emotive slogans or sensational fictions, but takes a bit of work to absorb and digest, but it's worth it.

That said, I am glad the marches are happening and will try to attend one with the family!


:good: :good: :good: :good:

here here for keeping one's head an avoiding hyperbole!

I'm glad the march is happening/happened of course too though, my small town seemed to have a good turnout.
"Just as a lotus does not grow out of a well-levelled soil but from the mire, in the same way the awakening mind
is not born in the hearts of disciples in whom the moisture of attachment has dried up. It grows instead in the hearts of ordinary sentient beings who possess in full the fetters of bondage." -Se Chilbu Choki Gyaltsen
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Mon May 27, 2013 3:33 am

The march here went very well! We had a turnout of about 450-500 people. Prior to starting the actual march, there was a speech by some local organic farmers and a woman from Children of Vietnam Veterans Health Alliance

We have created a community of people who desire to find justice, answers and support for the generational victims of Agent Orange/Dioxin. This is the first group of it’s kind because it was founded by children of Vietnam Veterans who have been born, and live with, the debilitating birth defects that Agent Orange/Dioxin are presumed to cause. We acknowledge there are many populations who have come into contact with Agent Orange, Americans, Australians, Vietnamese, Koreans, Canadians, Japanese, People of Guam and most likely more. The generational victims are rarely recognized. We are fighting together to change that. We have rights, we have a voice, and we will be heard.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR INTEREST IN OUR FIGHT

Mission Statement

We are committed to serving as a voice for the children of Vietnam Veterans including second and third generation victims of Agent Orange and Dioxin Exposures worldwide. We believe in empowering each other to hold the companies and governments responsible for causing so much devastation and suffering to our generations. We will fight for justice globally.


all went smoothly and I'm very glad this happened...

:applause:
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Sun Jun 02, 2013 5:50 am

If you have a smart phone, check out the app "Buycott". Since we clearly have no voting power due to corporate lobbying, we can vote with our currency. I've found this app very useful. It can scan barcodes of products and let you know if you are opposing the company or not according to what boycotting campaigns you've chosen to follow/join/pursue.

A powerful tool to have in these degenerate times.
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:17 pm

Hello MAM supporters and participants!!In mere hours, MAM events will start in New Zealand and revolve around the world as we embark on the second March Against Monsanto. This cause has truly united the world! Over 400 cities in 57 countries will take place as we, the citizens of the world, say NO to poison! 3 million people will stand up for the food supply, the environment, and our planet's sustainability. Join an event near you and be a part of this moment in time: http://bit.ly/Oct12MAM  This will go down in history books and we would like to thank YOU for supporting a cause that is very much one of the most important of our lifetimes. We would like to express our deep gratitude for all at the national level. MAM has an awesome team that has spent countless hours working hard to make these events an international victory!! We would also like to give a very special thank you to all of our local organizers, whose hard work and selfless dedication has been instrumental in the global success of MAM.We would like to give a very special thank you to Dr. Vandana Shiva and the Fortnight of Action For Seed & Food Freedom. Dr. Shiva has worked tirelessly for seed sovereignty and food freedom and it an honor to have her speaking at MAM London.This time, MAM has teamed up with the Children of Vietnam Veterans Heath Alliance. Agent Orange, a deadly toxin manufactured by Monsanto, has destroyed the lives of millions. MAM has teamed up COVVHA to allow the survivors of this horror a platform to tell their stories. Never before will so many Children of Vietnam Veterans be speaking out at the same time, on the same day, about how Agent Orange has affected their health, and the health of their families.As we set the course of history in motion, please keep in mind that the third March Against Monsanto is already planned for May 24, 2014. Get this information out there so we can all start building our events for Spring. Start promoting while you have an intrigued audience. Contact www.facebook.com/monstanto to set up an event for 5/24/14.Please be mindful that MAM is a peaceful movement and there will be kids and the elderly in attendance. Have a good, safe timetomorrow!! Take lots of pictures that you can submit to the MAM facebook page.The world will be watching tomorrow as we take a stand. We will not stand for poison. We will not stand for cronyism. And we thank you for standing up for what is right and marching against Monsanto.
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby disjointed » Sun Oct 13, 2013 2:43 am

I'm a little bothered by the idea that everything has to be non-violent.

Obviously the political system has failed around the world already.
Why do you think that non-violent methods will work?
Could it be because you've been deliberately fed the idea through public schooling and the media all your life to the benefit of your oppressors?

Violence is a legitimate method to resolve abuses from within the government and society.
Why do you think so many politicians have been pushing laws for smaller magazines and the media has been airing stories about shootings so often lately?

It doesn't take a genius to engineer a crisis or use scare tactics to manipulate a group of people.
If there is a radical inconsistency between your statements and the position you claim to hold,
you are a sock puppet.
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:04 am



This book is along the same lines as "Food Politics" by Marion Nestle, which I think is an excellent book.

Johnny Dangerous wrote:here here for keeping one's head an avoiding hyperbole!


Saying that GMO's are killing massive numbers of people without valid evidence, or with studies that have been manipulated to say they cause cancer, is hyperbole.

Other than that one aspect, all else is not. These corporations are scars on the planet in myriad ways.

disjointed wrote:I'm a little bothered by the idea that everything has to be non-violent.

Obviously the political system has failed around the world already.
Why do you think that non-violent methods will work?
Could it be because you've been deliberately fed the idea through public schooling and the media all your life to the benefit of your oppressors?

Violence is a legitimate method to resolve abuses from within the government and society.
Why do you think so many politicians have been pushing laws for smaller magazines and the media has been airing stories about shootings so often lately?

It doesn't take a genius to engineer a crisis or use scare tactics to manipulate a group of people.


Good luck with trying to violently strike against the monstrosity that is the military-industrial complex. That's a really good strategy to get them to clamp down harder and take away more "rights". It may affect some change in smaller, less developed countries, but I don't see that ever helping in the countries who hold stronger military powers.

There were kids at the march. That's mainly why they called for nonviolence. We passed out 600 fliers. No one got hurt. If you have any more effective ideas, please do share.
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Kim O'Hara » Mon Dec 30, 2013 5:43 am

Roland wrote:Good luck with trying to violently strike against the monstrosity that is the military-industrial complex. That's a really good strategy to get them to clamp down harder and take away more "rights". It may affect some change in smaller, less developed countries, but I don't see that ever helping in the countries who hold stronger military powers.

There were kids at the march. That's mainly why they called for nonviolence. We passed out 600 fliers. No one got hurt. If you have any more effective ideas, please do share.

I agree - if we try to play their game, we lose.
As for alternatives I like, in no particular order:
Community action days like the "March"
Crowd-funding of pressure groups and think-tanks - Avaaz, etc and (brilliant example in Australia) the Climate Council http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-09-24/tim-flannery-to-relaunch-climate-commission/4976608 and http://www.climatecouncil.org.au
Social media campaigns - FB (it's really all I use FB for!), Twitter, etc.
Blogging.
Writing - relentlessly! - to your local politicians and newspapers. Call them on their lies!

Less widely applicable:
Making movies like Gasland, Bag It!, etc.
Publicity stunts like Greenpeace's Arctic drilling "piracy".

Never ever give up!
:jedi:

But don't lose your cool or your sense of proportion either.
:meditate:

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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Mon Dec 30, 2013 6:38 am

I agree with all of that. I think more people than ever are starting to participate in activities, and that's good, but I we clearly need more. It seems like everything is going into a crescendo. Climate change, corporate power, fiat currency collapse, peak oil, soil nutrient loss, increasing health problems, increasing toxins in the environment... seems like it is near the peak of that crescendo, where everything will start to vibrate at the peak and break apart, and then swan dive into oblivion.

That's the way I see it. Even if its a skewed view of reality, I think its a useful way to see the world as a fuel for motivation to change things. I'm really not worried though. I just wish more people could mobilize and do all they can... but it seems to me that most people just sort of phase out when I tell them about things. I think people shutdown when they start hearing about all the apparent doom.. I get it. I think these forces we are up against are maybe too strong at this point. I don't know.

But violence isn't going to solve anything, really. It might change something, but it will be very short term and will result in police states. Plus, more violence and war is just further perpetuating the habitual patterns of society. The patterns of society clearly are not working out.

Another example is that some people who claim to want to change the world will arrogantly, angrily insult people who aren't "aware as they are". This sort of aggression is an awesome way to get people to stop listening to you as you reveal your clear emotional attachment to your cause.

If people could learn to channel their anger, violence, aggression etc. into an energy that can be used in a more skillful way, in a productive way like the many ways Kim has mentioned or to change something in a positive way... well I'm all for that. How do we teach people to do this?

:reading:
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Kim O'Hara » Mon Dec 30, 2013 7:26 am

Humour helps us not to lose our cool and to attract people's attention without being preachy or pushy. There's a whole new kind of visual communication developing on FB and I've been collecting examples - not necessarily funny, but not likely to turn people off either.
:namaste:
Kim

Here are a few:
origins.jpg
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mr whippy.png
mr whippy.png (406.98 KiB) Viewed 266 times

corny.png
corny.png (90.28 KiB) Viewed 254 times
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Kim O'Hara » Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:33 am

Two more:
save.jpg
save.jpg (25.7 KiB) Viewed 238 times

fortunate.jpg
fortunate.jpg (74.52 KiB) Viewed 248 times
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:25 am

I think we need to literally start at our roots. The roots - our soil is depleted and civilizations fall with depleted soil. Our roots - the roots of society, inner evolution. I don't see any stopping of the corporate infestation. They will continue to perpetuate the lie that we need monoculture - an intensely destructive practice - to feed the world. I think this will continue regardless, as long as it physically can. So we should just start restoring the soil and implement permaculture design systems so we will have a food supply as mechanized monoculture industrial agriculture runs itself into desertification. Then we can have that built in resiliency, hopefully not being dragged underneath the sand dunes alongside the corporatocray.
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Kim O'Hara » Thu Jan 02, 2014 2:16 am

Roland wrote:I think we need to literally start at our roots. The roots - our soil is depleted and civilizations fall with depleted soil. Our roots - the roots of society, inner evolution. I don't see any stopping of the corporate infestation. They will continue to perpetuate the lie that we need monoculture - an intensely destructive practice - to feed the world. I think this will continue regardless, as long as it physically can. So we should just start restoring the soil and implement permaculture design systems so we will have a food supply as mechanized monoculture industrial agriculture runs itself into desertification. Then we can have that built in resiliency, hopefully not being dragged underneath the sand dunes alongside the corporatocray.

Hi, Roland,
That all made perfect sense to me once I realised that you were right back on topic instead of letting it sprawl as it has in the last few posts.

The only part I would question is the sentence I have bolded. Corporations will keep doing what they've been doing for exactly as long as they are allowed to but it is always possible to push back. Never ever give up!
One way of pushing back is to do just what you suggest - starting in our own back yards and working outwards from there - but don't give up on the others.

:jedi:
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Re: March Against Monsanto

Postby Roland » Thu Jan 02, 2014 7:24 am

I will surely never give up the resistance. I think that is an integral part of affecting change, and it can change some things. At the very least, it can slow damage caused. I think voting with where one spends money is one very powerful form of resistance in particular.

Very good points you make here :twothumbsup:
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