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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:11 am 
pema ringdzin wrote:
how is that honoring those masters and teachings you revere?


Not all....In terms of keeping samayas, I follow the teaching of Samantabhadra the King of the Lineages of Bodhicitta (Bodhicitta Kulayaraja) over that of Dudjom in the final analysis....apologies since you missed the point.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:48 am 
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Buddhanataka wrote:
pema ringdzin wrote:
how is that honoring those masters and teachings you revere?


Not all....In terms of keeping samayas, I follow the teaching of Samantabhadra the King of the Lineages of Bodhicitta (Bodhicitta Kulayaraja) over that of Dudjom in the final analysis....apologies since you missed the point.

Well, Buddhanataka, since you rest in the nature of mind, you do not need to recite silly prayers like the rest of us.

Kevin

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:52 am 
Virgo wrote:
Buddhanataka wrote:
pema ringdzin wrote:
how is that honoring those masters and teachings you revere?


Not all....In terms of keeping samayas, I follow the teaching of Samantabhadra the King of the Lineages of Bodhicitta (Bodhicitta Kulayaraja) over that of Dudjom in the final analysis....apologies since you missed the point.

Well, Buddhanataka, since you rest in the nature of mind, you do not need to recite silly prayers like the rest of us.

Kevin


Whether that's true or not, the Manjushrinamasamgiti, the Guhyagarbha Tantra, and Laghusamvara and
Hevajra and Kalacakra and Tattvasamgraha and Durgatishodhana all the ocean of millions of mantras and dharanis and stotras and rddhividyas pronounced by all Buddhas andb bodhisattvas are not silly prayers as you prosaically name them by any means in fact they are great holy mantras with indescribable and miraculous spiritual power..!


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 4:11 am 
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Can we please lock this thread and not pander to Buddhanataka's delusions.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 5:03 am 
mr. gordo wrote:
Can we please lock this thread and not pander to Buddhanataka's delusions.


No it's not delusions, because they really are great holy miraculous mantras....It's reality, tattva or dharmata, whether you pander or not it doesn't change the dharma or reality-ness.

Delusions would be to think if you didn't pray 5times to Mecca today you must renew your vow or analogously if you were 2 hours late to your samaya because of filling out paperwork that it makes any dfference in the long run...That would be delusion. Not extolling the virtues of the Manjushri nama samgiti and the samayas of Samantabhadra Kulayaraja, that would be true and pious utterances in fact.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 5:48 am 
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Buddhanataka wrote:
mr. gordo wrote:
Can we please lock this thread and not pander to Buddhanataka's delusions.


No it's not delusions, because they really are great holy miraculous mantras....It's reality, tattva or dharmata, whether you pander or not it doesn't change the dharma or reality-ness.

Delusions would be to think if you didn't pray 5times to Mecca today you must renew your vow or analogously if you were 2 hours late to your samaya because of filling out paperwork that it makes any dfference in the long run...That would be delusion. Not extolling the virtues of the Manjushri nama samgiti and the samayas of Samantabhadra Kulayaraja, that would be true and pious utterances in fact.


Buddhanataka,

I wasn't referring to mantras. I was referring to your wholly inadequate understanding of samayas and your cavalier attitude towards guarding them. I honestly don't think you've even taken an empowerment, but that you've just read books you've misunderstood. Seriously.

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    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:44 am 
mr. gordo wrote:
Buddhanataka,

I wasn't referring to mantras. I was referring to your wholly inadequate understanding of samayas and your cavalier attitude towards guarding them. I honestly don't think you've even taken an empowerment, but that you've just read books you've misunderstood. Seriously.


I just find your approach slightly comical - like if the thief had come around at the wrong time you would have said "Sorry mate, I've got a samaya coming up, could you come back in half an hour?"
What if your wife went into labour, or you cut yourself and were bleeding, or your mother had a heart attack....Do you come over all giddy each time on account of your vows and how these events may be inconvenient in your observing them...? I don't see how that's detachment and all the qualities you espouse in your signature! Nor do I see how it's fundamentally any different to the behaviour of a Muslim or a Jesuit for instance!


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:08 am 
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With respect, maybe all friends can open another topic on samayas and leave it here?

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:39 am 
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Agree with Muni. This does not seem to be benefitting anyone.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:18 pm 
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Buddhanataka wrote:
mr. gordo wrote:
Buddhanataka,

I wasn't referring to mantras. I was referring to your wholly inadequate understanding of samayas and your cavalier attitude towards guarding them. I honestly don't think you've even taken an empowerment, but that you've just read books you've misunderstood. Seriously.


I just find your approach slightly comical - like if the thief had come around at the wrong time you would have said "Sorry mate, I've got a samaya coming up, could you come back in half an hour?"
What if your wife went into labour, or you cut yourself and were bleeding, or your mother had a heart attack....Do you come over all giddy each time on account of your vows and how these events may be inconvenient in your observing them...? I don't see how that's detachment and all the qualities you espouse in your signature! Nor do I see how it's fundamentally any different to the behaviour of a Muslim or a Jesuit for instance!


You seem to like ignoring the statements made by people in this thread concerning samayas, and my signature. Repeating yourself incessantly with inane examples does not justify it either.

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    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:40 pm 
mr. gordo wrote:
You seem to like ignoring the statements made by people in this thread concerning samayas, and my signature. Repeating yourself incessantly with inane examples does not justify it either.


You're perfectly right mr. g - we're all missing the important point here, which is, clearly -

The word is "burgled"....NOT "burglarized", which constitutes an singularal manglarization of the language.

By the bye out of interest, what WOULD happen if you wife went into labour while you were waiting for your next samaya session...Would you have to seek absolution the next day...? I'm curious about the rules surrounding your practice now. What about if you yourself had a heart attack and were laid up in hospital in a coma for 5 weeks, what are the rules in such cases.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:05 pm 
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Buddhanataka wrote:
mr. gordo wrote:
You seem to like ignoring the statements made by people in this thread concerning samayas, and my signature. Repeating yourself incessantly with inane examples does not justify it either.


You're perfectly right mr. g - we're all missing the important point here, which is, clearly -

The word is "burgled"....NOT "burglarized", which constitutes an singularal manglarization of the language.

By the bye out of interest, what WOULD happen if you wife went into labour while you were waiting for your next samaya session...Would you have to seek absolution the next day...? I'm curious about the rules surrounding your practice now. What about if you yourself had a heart attack and were laid up in hospital in a coma for 5 weeks, what are the rules in such cases.


How old are you, man? Seriously, you're acting like a child. It's also puzzling to see you minimize and belittle the "rules" of samaya, which are explained in tantras such as these that you mention below and fawn over:

Buddhanataka wrote:
Whether that's true or not, the Manjushrinamasamgiti, the Guhyagarbha Tantra, and Laghusamvara and
Hevajra and Kalacakra and Tattvasamgraha and Durgatishodhana all the ocean of millions of mantras and dharanis and stotras and rddhividyas pronounced by all Buddhas andb bodhisattvas are not silly prayers as you prosaically name them by any means in fact they are great holy mantras with indescribable and miraculous spiritual power..!


So, for you, which is it??? Is it holy, inseparable from wisdom, and full of power, or is it silly and neurotic?


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:13 pm 
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Buddhanataka wrote:
mr. gordo wrote:
You seem to like ignoring the statements made by people in this thread concerning samayas, and my signature. Repeating yourself incessantly with inane examples does not justify it either.


You're perfectly right mr. g - we're all missing the important point here, which is, clearly -

The word is "burgled"....NOT "burglarized", which constitutes an singularal manglarization of the language.

By the bye out of interest, what WOULD happen if you wife went into labour while you were waiting for your next samaya session...Would you have to seek absolution the next day...? I'm curious about the rules surrounding your practice now. What about if you yourself had a heart attack and were laid up in hospital in a coma for 5 weeks, what are the rules in such cases.


::yawn::

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    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:44 am 
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mr. gordo wrote:
Can we please lock this thread

Yes.

Buddhanataka, it is wholly inappropriate to enter into the Vajrayana section, where vajra brothers and sisters can discuss the practice and tradition and for you start mocking ours system and ways of practice.

If you have questions about samaya I would recommend starting a respectful thread with questions about it, or refrain from posting in this area. There are many sections in this Mahayana forum and samaya is specific to Vajrayana.

Please remember Right Speech, which is incorporated into the Terms of Service at Dharma Wheel and you agreed to upon signing up for account. As I said, please feel free to use other areas of the forum which may be more comfortable for you.

This thread degenerated and is now locked. As samaya is obviously paramoun in Vajrayana practice, I hope the issue will resurface in the Vajrayana subforums in the future so that members can act as supports to one another.

Best,
Laura


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 9:48 am 
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Bumped


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