username wrote:- You can deny the justifications of war in the name of various Buddhist sects. But those sects' abbots & leaders throughout history to this day in Sri Lanka, being investigated by the UN War Crimes group, know more about their sects than you do & will surely not fall apart in debate according to their own tenets with you. This is just a fantasy.
No, I stand by my assertion. Their arguments would falter quite easily.
- The point in that paragraph was the non Tibetan Buddhist institutions of Hinayana & Mahayana in various Asian countries also have histories of institutional corruption within politics & violence to this very day. Your ignoring & whitewashing of them is simply naive & when pointed out & ignored just not right.
I'm not ignoring it. I've even recognized that it exists.
I'm simply saying the sanction of violence is indefensible doctrinally. Whatever abbots or Buddhists do is up to them, but if they want to justify their violent acts with Buddhist doctrine they will fail.
- Hinayana included many schools including Theravada. Your suggestion that Vajrayana stop calling it Hinayana is basically absurd as you ask them to basically change their religion and accept Hinayana claims. This is like telling the Jews to accept Jesus as Messiah & the Christians to accept Mohammed as the last & greatest prophet! That will be a new religion and not Vajrayana. Similarly you would want Mahayana to drop their basic beliefs WRT to Hinayana. You are basically asking Vajrayana & Mahayana religions and sub-schools to completely change their religions' many principles. As I said your assertions are simplistic in nature & completely unbalanced. I really do not see any point in even discussing things at this unrealistic level.
This is absurd. I'm suggesting that they stop using a pejorative against fellow Buddhists. Alternatives exist like "Śrāvakayāna". Where do you get the idea I'm advocating that they change their whole religion?
I'm suggesting people stop using a pejorative term when referring to fellow Buddhists.
- You also ignore the fact that a few gestures by the handful of token examples of inter-sect studies or what some monk told you on the streets of Nepal does not mean the establishment of Hinayana & Mahayana have changed their religions. This is coffee shop level reasoning, not serious debate. And there have been similar inter-sect token gestures by TB lamas too. These token few extrapolations are far from the reality of all those religions changing their historical fundamental tenets.
There is often the official party line and what everyone on the streets is doing. Two different things.
- On various sects living in close proximity in certain locations, every sect visits their centers in Bodhgaya too and rubs shoulders with each other as Christian sects do in Jerusalem but no one is changing their religion. Again it does not follow any tectonic shifting of plates is taking place within any group's established doctrines.
Perhaps you did not fully understand the purport of what I wrote above. There is plenty of exchange going on between East Asian and Theravadin traditions, particularly in the sphere of education.
Reform takes time.
- You also completely ignore the perilous situation facing Tibetans' culture & practices & lineages & texts they have been trying to save recently in exile I mentioned that even non Buddhists are aware of. Again utterly unrealistic in expecting them to abandon their Vajrayana principles in favor of Hinayana while they have their hands full both under repression inside & struggling to survive in exile. While seeing no fault within the institutions sharing power, sometimes corruptly, by others elsewhere in Asia in luxury.
I never advocated they should drop their Vajrayāna practices.
Or similarly if Mahayana starts accepting Vajrayana claims, which again despite a few people researching a few papers (meaningless) or what a monk says on the street, has also not happened.
Are you unaware that East Asia had their own tradition of Mantrayāna (yoga-tantra, became Shingon and Taimitsu in Japan)? The enormous realm of "Mahāyāna" (which I assume you mean East Asian Buddhist traditions) are not necessarily opposed to the claims of Vajrayāna, especially given that a lot practices originally came from the ancient Mantrayāna movement (mantras and various rites). The idea of buddhahood in one lifetime is also not necessarily outright rejected.
In any case "Mahāyāna" in this context is way too broad to meaningfully discuss.
HOWEVER Vajrayana accepts all of Hinayana & Mahayana as valid & true teachings of Buddha. There is nothing to be done regarding those. As I said they are an accepted ontological subset of Vajrayana beliefs. Kangyur & Tengyur have been part of TB studies since King Trisong asked Shanta & Padma to bring Buddhism to Tibet. We can not renew our acceptance of them like aged couples renewing their wedding vows. We never stopped believing in Hinayana or Mahayana to be asked to accept them again! However the lower schools never accepted the higher ones. This seems to completely escape you.
It isn't all black and white like you suggest. Plenty of internal elements are not so decisively individuated as you make it seem.