Completion Stage

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Completion Stage

Postby Enochian » Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:04 pm

This is my understanding of completion stage (based entirely on Unrestricted sources).

Completion stage is pretty much the same in all schools.

First you do tummo and then karmamudra (or jhanamudra).

Lamdre has these two, but also has a third practice called Vajra Waves which is a fancy variation on karmamudra.
There is an ever-present freedom from grasping the mind.

Mind being defined as the thing always on the Three Times.
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Re: Completion Stage

Postby Josef » Sat Apr 23, 2011 5:33 pm

Enochian wrote:This is my understanding of completion stage (based entirely on Unrestricted sources).

Completion stage is pretty much the same in all schools.

First you do tummo and then karmamudra (or jhanamudra).

Lamdre has these two, but also has a third practice called Vajra Waves which is a fancy variation on karmamudra.


Its more individual based than this and the approaches are more diverse.
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Re: Completion Stage

Postby Enochian » Sun Apr 24, 2011 2:46 am

Are there any secrets that Lamas are still holding onto, unknown to the public?
There is an ever-present freedom from grasping the mind.

Mind being defined as the thing always on the Three Times.
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Re: Completion Stage

Postby gnegirl » Sun Apr 24, 2011 2:51 am

Enochian wrote:Are there any secrets that Lamas are still holding onto, unknown to the public?


:alien: Define 'public'.

Of course there are things not out in the 'public' sphere, as there are things out there that are 'self-secret' because a casual reading of such would normally not make much sense. This is not a problem. This is not a puzzle to be solved.

The only puzzle to solve is how to uproot the root of samsara itself, and free all beings from its grip, as soon as possible.
"Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise." --Surangama Sutra

Phenomenon, vast as space, dharmata is your base, arising and falling like ocean tide cycles, why do i cling to your illusion of unceasing changlessness?
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Re: Completion Stage

Postby Enochian » Fri Apr 29, 2011 5:19 am

My understanding since talking to a PhD scholar, is that kundalini and tummo are similar from the viewpoint of actually how to do it....i.e. holding ones breath, mulabandha etc.

They only differ on what happens automatically, spiral vs straight.
There is an ever-present freedom from grasping the mind.

Mind being defined as the thing always on the Three Times.
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Re: Completion Stage

Postby conebeckham » Fri Apr 29, 2011 5:58 pm

"Tummo" means different things depending on tradition, believe it or not. It has multivalent meaning. As a method, it is part of Completion stage in some, but not all, traditions. Even amongst one tradition, for example, Tummo may not be a part of a given completion stage.

In the Sarma, Father Tantra practices are not so concerned with Tummo, actually. It belongs more to Mother Tantra practices. Other "methods" of completion stage are Illusory Body, Clear Light, etc. this is according to the Tantras themselves. In the category of Esoteric Instructions, from the Eight Chariots of Practice, for example, Tummo is by no means common to all Chariots, nor even to all sadhanas within any given chariot.

In the Nyingma, as per another thread, it seems that Tummo, per se, was not really part of any Kama Completion Stage. Amongst the Terma Traditions, of course, it's widespread, but by no means universal. Also, it is relegated to a lesser status, in general, from what I've seen, and the Dzokchen Completion Stage practices of Trekcho and Togal take precedence.
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