Khechara

Khechara

Postby Konchog1 » Mon Dec 16, 2013 7:11 am

I know it is a Tantric Pure Land (whatever that means) and that Tantric practice is the cause to be reborn there (especially the practice of Vajrayogini).

Besides from that, what are the properties of Khechara? What is life there like? How does Khechara differ from Sukhavati?

Thank you.
Equanimity is the ground. Love is the moisture. Compassion is the seed. Bodhicitta is the result.

-Paraphrase of Khensur Rinpoche Lobsang Tsephel citing the Guhyasamaja Tantra

"All memories and thoughts are the union of emptiness and knowing, the Mind.
Without attachment, self-liberating, like a snake in a knot.
Through the qualities of meditating in that way,
Mental obscurations are purified and the dharmakaya is attained."

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Re: Khechara

Postby Malcolm » Mon Dec 16, 2013 5:28 pm

Konchog1 wrote:I know it is a Tantric Pure Land (whatever that means) and that Tantric practice is the cause to be reborn there (especially the practice of Vajrayogini).

Besides from that, what are the properties of Khechara? What is life there like? How does Khechara differ from Sukhavati?

Thank you.



For one there are women there...
http://www.atikosha.org
http://www.bhaisajya.net
http://www.bhaisajya.guru
http://www.sakyapa.net
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

How can you not practice the highest Dharma
at this time of obtaining a perfect human body?

-- Jetsun Dragpa Gyaltsen
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Re: Khechara

Postby conebeckham » Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:54 pm

^ Suh-Weeet!

Ima pack my bags.
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Re: Khechara

Postby Tsongkhapafan » Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:12 pm

Konchog1 wrote:I know it is a Tantric Pure Land (whatever that means) and that Tantric practice is the cause to be reborn there (especially the practice of Vajrayogini).

Besides from that, what are the properties of Khechara? What is life there like? How does Khechara differ from Sukhavati?

Thank you.


In Sukahavati it is not possible to practise Highest Yoga Tantra because there is no bodily basis to do so. In Khechara, the beings possess channels, winds and drops and so they can engage in completion stage meditations. They also receive Highest Yoga Tantra teachings directly from Heruka and Vajrayogini so they can attain enlightenment swiftly by following the HYT path. It is said that bodhisattvas in Sukhavati pray to be reborn in a realm such as ours so that they have the suitable bodily basis for practising Highest Yoga Tantra.
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Re: Khechara

Postby plwk » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:06 pm

In Sukahavati it is not possible to practise Highest Yoga Tantra because there is no bodily basis to do so.
From Amitabha's 48 vows....
If, when I attain Buddhahood, bodhisattvas in My land should not be able to hear spontaneously whatever teachings they may wish, may I not attain Perfect Enlightenment. The Larger Amitayus Sutra
It is said that bodhisattvas in Sukhavati pray to be reborn in a realm such as ours so that they have the suitable bodily basis for practising Highest Yoga Tantra.
And the source text for this is...
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Re: Khechara

Postby kirtu » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:46 pm

plwk wrote:
In Sukahavati it is not possible to practise Highest Yoga Tantra because there is no bodily basis to do so.
From Amitabha's 48 vows....
If, when I attain Buddhahood, bodhisattvas in My land should not be able to hear spontaneously whatever teachings they may wish, may I not attain Perfect Enlightenment. The Larger Amitayus Sutra
It is said that bodhisattvas in Sukhavati pray to be reborn in a realm such as ours so that they have the suitable bodily basis for practising Highest Yoga Tantra.
And the source text for this is...


Well, my Sakya lama told me this personally when I asked him. Basically we go to Sukhavati, stay there, attain Enlightenment there and then we send out emanations. But we don't practice tantra there as there is no basis for the body energies and secondly, because we don't need tantra there. Tantra is for people with "lot's and lot's of obstacles" (quote from my Sakya lama during an empowerment). In Sukhavati there are no more obstacles aside from our remaining delusions, many of which got wiped out by being born in Sukhavati.

Kirt
Last edited by kirtu on Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
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Re: Khechara

Postby kirtu » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:51 pm

conebeckham wrote:^ Suh-Weeet!

Ima pack my bags.


Just don't go back for your mala ....

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche
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Re: Khechara

Postby plwk » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:55 pm

Delusions, however many remaining, is not an obstacle, kirt? How is 'obstacle' defined then?
Besides, it's not uncommon to mistaken that one goes to Sukhavati with a near zero slate, it's just that whatever is 'on my slate' doesn't get a chance to turn into a festering pus compared to being under Sahaloka's conditions compared to Sukhavati's... that's how I understand it

And don't forget there's the Nine Grades...
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Re: Khechara

Postby Barney Fife » Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:44 pm

From Jamgon Kongtrul, The Treasury of Knowledge Books 9 and 10: Journey and Goal:
Khecara:
Concerning Khecara, there are two aspects: the greater state of Khecara and
the lesser states. [4.193.a]
Greater State [i]
In conjunction with these siddhis, the greater state of Khecara
is one endowed with the eight qualities such as subtle form.
The full experience of one’s realization is a naturally manifesting realm of
complete purity.
In general, the term “Khecara” signifies simply one’s body flying through the
air,851 whether due to recognition of awareness through tantric practice, or
consumption of the flesh of one reborn seven times as a brahmin,852 or the
circumstances of one’s rebirth due to the power of karma. But the term
“Khecara” in conjunction with the siddhis that derive from one’s practice on
the stage of development (both the most sublime siddhi and the greater
siddhis) is what I am specifically explaining at this point. It can be treated in
two ways: as a greater state and lesser states.
In the first place, then, there is the state of Khecara endowed with the
eight qualities. These eight are discussed in the Frond of Pith Instructions:
The subtlety of a body composed of extremely subtle particles; the lightness
of that body; its pervasiveness throughout the three worlds; the attainment
of the qualities of buddhahood; the experiential field of timeless awareness;
the gaining of stability in that; the bringing of all beings under one’s
influence; and one’s rebirth into a consummate state that ensures all that is
wished for. As is said:
These are:
subtlety of form, lightness to the touch,
pervasiveness, true attainment,
extreme clarity, reliability,
endowment with power, and a consummate state ensuring all that is wished
for.853
The eight qualities of powerful ma stery are described as subtlety of form
and the other aspects: that is, extreme subtlety, lightness, extreme
magnitude, the ability to move everywhere, the state of being worthy due to
one’s clarity, the exercise of mastery, and the ability to abide wherever one
wishes.
The present eight qualities and the aforementioned eight mundane
qualities of powerful mastery are simply called by different names; [4.193.b]
they are identical in meaning. As for “subtlety” and “lightness,” for example,
the terms and their meaning are the same in both cases. The aforementioned
quality of “governance” corresponds to either “pervasiveness” or
“magnitude” in this present case because the meaning of all three terms lies
in the quality of pervading the three worlds. One should understand that
similar correspondences exist in the case of the other qualities.
In actuality, this greater state constitutes the consummate fruition of the
stage of development and the full experience of the realization of the stage
of completion, so that one trains to further one’s realization on the path
within a naturally manifesting realm of complete purity.
Lesser States [ii]
The lesser states of Khecara are seventeen associated with the realm of form,
six associated with the gods of the realm of desire,
and the indeterminate one associated with the human realm, which can be
seen by pure yogic practitioners.
One may arrive there without discarding the physical body, or having discarded
it,or be led there by yakṣī spirits or siddhas (a temporary magical experience).
Some reach there through meditation; because this involves engaging in
meditative stability and attaining a rainbow body, they progress along the spiritual path, taking a
firm stance.
There are many versions of the lesser state of Khecara, but if these are
summarized into different types, they pertain to the seventeen states of the
realm of form, the six classes of gods in the realm of desire, and the
indeterminate state of Khecara in the human realm.
Of these, the state of Khecara in the human realm is such that, while one
remains in the world of human beings, other ordinary people are unable to
see one, although it is possible that a few truly remarkable individuals may
be able to see and meet with one.
As for the state of Khecara in the realms of the gods, there are six states
of Khecara associated with the six classes of gods in the realm of desire. In
whichever of these one is able to experience, one enjoys the respective
wealth of that state and a lifespan equal to, or even longer than, the gods in
that state. This principle applies in a similar fashion to the realm of form, so
that there are sixteen or seventeen further states of Khecara.
In all of the foregoing cases, there are two options, depending on whether
one has discarded one’s physical body or not. In cases in which the physical
body has not been discarded, moreover, [4.194.a] there are two further
cases: those who attain the state of Khecara through the power of their
cultivation of the spiritual path, and those who are led to the state of
Khecara through the power of yakṣī spirits, siddhas (that is, masters of
awareness), or others. The latter case is simply temporary; regardless of
what circumstances one experiences (whether higher or lower) or how long
these last, this is not a case of “taking a firm stance.”854
As for the state of Khecara to which one traverses through the power of
meditating on the path of profound practice, whether one has discarded the
physical body or not, one’s body is refined into what is, by nature, a body of
light, while one’s meditative stability becomes sublime. Therefore, one
progresses along the spiritual path, and so this is known as “the state of
Khecara in which one takes a firm stance.”

b.f.
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