Wrathful deity iconography just not terrifying enough

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Re: Wrathful deity iconography just not terrifying enough

Postby futerko » Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:42 am

padma norbu wrote:Yes, well, that's basically what it's all about. When the baddies got ya down, who can you turn to? That's right: the goody that scares the bajeezus out of the baddy. The extreme fierceness of these bali Garuda statues really helps to convey the sheer power in a way that seems most appropriate (to me, anyway). Compare to this and see if you get the same feeling...


I don't see it in terms of co-opting good to fight the baddies, but rather to get them both moving harmoniously towards liberation beyond hope and fear.
I mean that the wrathful deities and guardians are pretty scary and should remain so, rather then them being "on your side", it is you who moves to a view where harm to one's self is no longer a consideration - in effect, to "tame" them one must tame one's reaction to what scares the bajeezus out of you!
we cannot get rid of God because we still believe in grammar - Nietzsche
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Re: Wrathful deity iconography just not terrifying enough

Postby Sherab Dorje » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:33 am

heart wrote:Use your mind, it is capable of constructing all the endless horrors of Samsara. Pictures and statues are fine but nothing comes close to what your own mind can do, just learn the ancient art of visualization.

/magnus
Ain't that the truth! I recently watched a video/documentary on Liberia. It scared the crap out of me to see what human beings are capable of. Makes the Dharmapala look tame in comparison.
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: Wrathful deity iconography just not terrifying enough

Postby padma norbu » Thu Oct 31, 2013 3:59 pm

futerko wrote:
padma norbu wrote:Yes, well, that's basically what it's all about. When the baddies got ya down, who can you turn to? That's right: the goody that scares the bajeezus out of the baddy. The extreme fierceness of these bali Garuda statues really helps to convey the sheer power in a way that seems most appropriate (to me, anyway). Compare to this and see if you get the same feeling...


I don't see it in terms of co-opting good to fight the baddies, but rather to get them both moving harmoniously towards liberation beyond hope and fear.
I mean that the wrathful deities and guardians are pretty scary and should remain so, rather then them being "on your side", it is you who moves to a view where harm to one's self is no longer a consideration - in effect, to "tame" them one must tame one's reaction to what scares the bajeezus out of you!


That, too. The reason I didn't want to write a whole big thing explaining my reasons illustrated here well. Can never say enough to cover all aspects of a topic.
"Use what seems like poison as medicine. We can use our personal suffering as the path to compassion for all beings." Pema Chodron
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Re: Wrathful deity iconography just not terrifying enough

Postby T. Chokyi » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:36 pm

Konchog1 wrote:Personally, the only wrathful deity that scares me is my yidam.


That's too bad, sorry you have that dualistic vision. If your own display (your yidam) still scares you then your ego is on one side, and the yidam is over there on the other side scaring you, it's a dualistic vision. The feirce aspect of a yidam is compassionate response to what needs taming. :shrug:

These manifestations aren't out there somewhere, these manifestations are part of our own Vajra body and not seperate from the potentiality of our nature.

If it scares you while you are alive then in the bardo your consciousness will "hide" and "run" like the beeeejeeesus when the wrathful display appears. :jawdrop:
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