"This"

[Ngawang Drolma]

So what would be the origin of these false thoughts of solidity?

Karma?

[catmoon]

So what would be the origin of these false thoughts of solidity?

Karma?

Don't be bowin down! This is SO frustrating! I'm looking for pragmatic explanations and all I get is these awful vague platitudes that are of no use!
ARRRRRRRGH!

[/rant]

[el gatito]

... i find its the other way round for me! sound is a tough knot. i directly perceive the emptiness of self nature and of mind and emptiness of all forms, but sound! well that ones truly got me stumped for the moment. though i take it in faith that there is no sound as the heart sutra says. i feel i must perceive this for myself ...

Actually, I know nothing about "directly perceiving" the "emptiness", or any other qualities of the sound. Still, I have found it very interesting -- to look into the true nature of it. I don't like to use such words as "meditation", or similar.. and my humble attempts to practice the "seeing" into the present moment as regards sound, when the source of the sound is some "real" thing (like, say, river, rain, or burning wood) have yielded no "results" as of yet.. Nonetheless -- the "sound" is very interesting.. "thing".

[Karma Dondrup Tashi]

Karma?

Don't be bowin down! This is SO frustrating! I'm looking for pragmatic explanations and all I get is these awful vague platitudes that are of no use!
ARRRRRRRGH!

[/rant]

Aw c'mon lemme have a bow. Me want.

[Ngawang Drolma]

Aw c'mon lemme have a bow. Me want.

[White Lotus]

this day is a good day!
this traffic blowing past,
this life, not long to last,
this computer, nothing but buttons,
this game, we call life.
this Mind which encompasses all.
this ignorance that we call...
enlightenment.
This.

so... i should not attach to 'this', potent as it is.
el Gatito. nice poem. thank you. yes

having touched no thing
it fades away unnoticed
leaving no traces..

when emptiness (no thing) is perceived then 'this' fades away, unnoticed, leaving no traces, but when emptiness is penetrated i would say:

the mists of emptiness blown aside,
the landscape once more seen.

the words won't hit "this"!..
discussing what's "this", what's not
has little merit..

'this' little word is it, just as it is, sometimes words will do, sometimes they just wont, but it neednt be 'this', it could be toilet, or shit on a stick or three pounds of flax. actually, with Mind you can say what you want without fear of falling into dualisms since duality is also Mind, just as it is.

with gratitude, White Lotus.

your roof is leaking. my toilet's blocked.

[el gatito]

On a serious note however, during the rain season here in the South of Chile (that has just started) -- one would be truly amazed. For there's no lack of the "clouds and mists", "wind and rain", really. Hence, not a "poem", no. You just have to open your window, and look out.

[White Lotus]

t Noble El Gatito, to me, stuck in London... not much rain, winds and mist! many cars, busses and a lot of buildings. also many people, many of them hurting. im sorry to hear that your roof leaks.

best wishes, White Lotus.

[el gatito]

no laughing matter
lets try to be serious
"this" stuck in your bowl..

[noclue]

Say, Noble White Lotus, could you tell us something about your day (apart from the rain)?

How does a Noble One spend the waking hours?

[White Lotus]

Noble No Clue,
i am no more noble than you. we are all buddhas.

my day...
get up late
do some reading (minds freshest earlier)
have a sandwich for lunch/breakfast and a yoghurt.
listen to some Jazz for half an hour or so.
get the bus.
have a cup of coffee, see a friend, work in the shop.
do shopping.
use the internet.
go home...
spiritual practice.
supper from the chinese or supermarket mostly.
listen to jazz.
spiritual practice.
take my medication. do some reading.
spiritual practice.
go to bed late.

my life is not ordinary, because i suffer from illness, but i largely choose isolation so that i can practice. I believe that anyone can experience enlightenment, that it is within anyones ability to understand enlightenment, but i cannot call myself enlightened since i have no conviction of being enlightened, also, how can no one attain enlightenment. if there is no one how can there be a conviction?

i know enlightenment, i see what it is, but i cannot attach to it, nor can it attach to me therefore i am not enlightened. some people are enlightend. i have two aquaintances who are clearly enlightened and still have experience of the mundane I. I have no experience of the I.

so, thats a little bit about my day.

with love, from White Lotus.

[el gatito]

This small river originates in the snowy Andes mountains, and the water is so pure, and is icy cold. Day by day, if you were watching these tiny silver threads flowing by, that are mere reflections of the sun rays on the surface of the water, then would you not perceive that the water is not "water"?.. Not "water", but is just a play of some melted diamonds, they don't (and can't) "flow" at all.. The "water" is perfectly still, just look.. like some magical crystal.. "this"?..

This grass is no longer green. Autumn wind blowing -- golden waves running.. And as soon as the wind stops blowing -- every single blade of the grass is perfectly still.. all stops!.. "this"?..

This white cloud is so lazy, it just hangs over the mountain silently, hour by hour, and is unwilling to go anywhere.. now look at its shadow -- its so calm, quiet, and motionless.. "this"?..

No, no, no, in no way! Not "this". I know, I know!.. This is not "this"!..

Just maybe.. "that"?..

[White Lotus]

that will do just fine if you want it to, but actually neither 'this' nor 'that', only fingers pointing toward the moon. This is not this. This is this. This is neither this nor not this, this is both this and not this, this is none of these things and yet... this is all of these things. you can say what you want el gatito, it is after all only mind. how about... this is a lazy cloud. or there is no 'this' whatsoever. just words, but fun anyway.

sounds like a good spot youve got for yourself. make the most of.

this lazy cloud is residing in my mind right now. he is smiling. is he in your mind too... smiling?

best wishes, White Lotus.

the rules of 'reality' are
not as simple as we think
they are. any word or name
can simply be blown away
like a leaf in the wind...
it is however still a leaf...
for a while. everything is
this one leaf. the omniscient
universal leaf. in one are
contained all things, in the many
one finds the one.
one is a leaf that blows in the wind.

Melted diamonds, yes i like that. i can feel them on my finger tips, lapping my mind.

[el gatito]

... a leaf that blows in the wind ...

these leaves that are blown
by gentle wind
these twigs that are broken
by harsh rainstorm

they cover entirely
my wooden terrace
with precious carpet
of golden and red

I'm about to reach
for my old broom
that's made of fine bamboo
long-handled and strong

but look, the north wind
is now sweeping away
all these leaves and twigs..
in no time -- all is clean!

[White Lotus]

Noble el gatito!

very nice, the golden
and red leaves, colours of
enlightenment,
naturally swept away
by the winds of what is.

sitting at the internet
kiosk, tapping away at
the keys. its fun, but
theres not much to say.

a heavy red bus passes
rumbling engine swishing cars
i enjoyed that poem blown
in on the wind.

ice creams out of fashion
these days. but a cup of
tea still appreciated at the
start and end of the day.

have one on me. pg tips is
recommended.

with respect, White Lotus.

nothing profound these days.

[Dharma_Disciple]

I seek to directly experience self, form and body as "empty" ...
but i still cannot directly experience self, form and body as "empty"...

The self...
"nothing special, nothing special"...i say, but special arise in my mind constantly
The body...
"nothing special, nothing special"...i say, but special arise in my mind incessantly
Forms...
"nothing special, nothing special"...i say, but special arise in my mind without fail

why why why, i cannot losta mind, i am losta...
ego mind, constant, incessant, without fail
root in clinging,
dreaming...not over...
help
help
where do i start
please?

kind regards DD

[Dechen Norbu]

Start by studying the Dharma. Remember the thre prajnas: hearing, contemplating and meditating?
Hearing means learning (listening to teachings/ reading teachings), contemplating the teachings means reflecting carefully about what one has heard and finally meditation, made more clear by what we learned.
This thread is full of hot air. It's the first time I see it... it was buried it seems. IMO, it should have stayed that way.

[fukasetsu]

why why why, i cannot losta mind, i am losta...
ego mind, constant, incessant, without fail
root in clinging,
dreaming...not over...
help
help

Ah, how many times have such sentiments arisen, futilely laboring to control the mind, and never really leaving any "ego mind" or everything behind, alas. It's the one who would do the leaving that must be left behind, but that is not possible, since leaving is still in consciousness, and one cannot leave consciousness, but only realize it as stress itself, as a fraud and a cheat, and so stand aloof in the witness-only position until that too is undermined in the bright blast of the real. I say bright blast, but that is just words, and the truth is that it will sneak up on you when all the crap has evaporated to some extent.

where do i start

Don't try to get rid of anything, don't try to join with anything.

Going, coming, sitting, standing,
Don't attach to anything.
Affirming no direction,
Can there be leaving or entering?
----
Mind is without alienation;
No need to terminate lust.
Nature being empty, lust will
Depart by itself.
Allow the mind to float and sink.
~Niutou Farong - song of Mind

[Dechen Norbu]

"Don't try to get rid of anything, don't try to join with anything."

Sound advice, but needs unpacking.