Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Anything goes (almost).

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby Jikan » Thu Nov 03, 2011 9:25 pm

Come now.

Everyone knows that Buddha was a Republican.

http://integrallife.com/node/117662

So buy yours now!

***

I think it's safe to say that Buddha Shakyamuni would have a critique of consumer capitalism of the kind Mr Wilber practices.
Thanks to the help of generous sponsors (most of them from DharmaWheel), I'm doing a Vajra Armor (Dorje Kotrab) self-retreat this summer. May the merit be yours!
Jikan
Site Admin
 
Posts: 4975
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:04 pm

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby Karma Dondrup Tashi » Fri Nov 04, 2011 1:29 am

Ken f-in Wilbur.

:rolling:
Karma Dondrup Tashi
 
Posts: 1014
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2009 7:13 pm

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby tobes » Fri Nov 04, 2011 1:09 pm

Is this for real????:

"More Than Just Theory
Advanced Integral is not just about complex theory. Rather, it grounds your search for knowledge in its philosophical roots, while at the same time allowing you to use Integral Theory to actively make better sense of your life. "

That's some scary deranged manure going down on that website....

:anjali:
Last edited by tobes on Sat Nov 05, 2011 10:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
tobes
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 1139
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:02 am

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby tobes » Fri Nov 04, 2011 1:19 pm

I suppose this explains why Billy Corgan sacked the drummer and barely produced one decent track after Meloncholy and the Infinite Sadness.

A good metaphor for what happened to grunge in general - got appropriated by some hollowed out capitalistic-Hegelian-monster who's catch cry is: you can have it all and be good!

http://integrallife.com/contributors/billy-corgan
User avatar
tobes
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 1139
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:02 am

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby ronnewmexico » Fri Nov 04, 2011 6:25 pm

Billy Corgan has now launched a prowrestling endeavor. I don't know him but have seen some in this field have some insights of a sort those due to different cause such as drug useage and then have those insights devolve as drawn from drug they are nonsustainable..hence the sixties revolution and revolutionaries eventually becoming the boomers of today entirely consumptive in ideology. Bob Dylan and his stint as a born again christian in the eighties may be a example of this.....Hunter Thompson going seemingly from left to far right then before the end back to left,(as I read it), perhaps another's insights influenced by drugs, and hence their variance. I guess I could name a bunch. Drugs produce insight but they are entirely unsustainable. The rebound being to the opposite direction, it seems better for most all to never have taken them they ended up lesser in insight in the end or present.

what it is is they try unconsciously to combine the two(as we unconsciously try to make sense of things) the old insight now devolved with the new lesser thing....to result sometimes of the bizzare sort.....fundamentalism perhaps radical political philosophy(Ted Neugent) and other.

Corgan seems as of his 09 album seems theist in orientation.
Prior some seemingly buddhist insights

In any event far far right and far far left usually end up in the same political place....a anarchy type philosophy.
I'd guess Wilber with his statements on the buddha being a republican is comeing from far left to right as this is a circle of sorts.
HIs philosophy..I personally have studied it years ago found it of no use and never revisited it....No means to my opinion...all blab and thusly to no effect and eventually faulted.

Didn't know Billy C was a adherant,which it appears he certainly is...he a couple of years ago gave a dissertation on Carl Yung's dream book at a tibetan institute/museum in NYC. Assumed they would have vetted him but there were a large number of these talks and maybe they wanted to introduce all views on the subject. Even Ken Wilbers.
Carl Yung who wrote the introduction to the publication of a english version of the Tibetan book of the dead many years ago.
The dream was not allowed to be published until something like fifty years after his death at his families and presumable his intention.

Billy C useing his platform of celebrity to launch another pro wrestling endeavor seems more ted neugent than carl yung.
So socialist I'd say not...probably now strong libertarian, as pro wrestlers are sometimes known to be.
Jessie ventura being most famous in that specific.
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.
User avatar
ronnewmexico
 
Posts: 1601
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby tobes » Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:00 am

Pro wrestling ay?!! Oh dear.

I suppose if we're going to be strict about critiquing Corgan, we could probably look at that old lyric from Zero

"Emptiness is loneliness and loneliness is cleaniness and cleaniness is godliness and god is empty just like me!"

Can't say I thought very deeply about that in 1995, but now that I think about it, I'll grant three possibilities

1/ He was quite a nuanced negative theologian.
2/ He made an attempt at Nagarjuna, but misread him catastrophically.
3/ The signifiers fit the chord structure reasonably well.

I'm betting three.

:anjali:
User avatar
tobes
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 1139
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:02 am

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby tobes » Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:05 am

For the very old or the very young who have no idea who Billy Corgan is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJOGq5XTojo
User avatar
tobes
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 1139
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:02 am

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby Jikan » Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:31 pm

tobes wrote:Pro wrestling ay?!! Oh dear.

I suppose if we're going to be strict about critiquing Corgan, we could probably look at that old lyric from Zero

"Emptiness is loneliness and loneliness is cleaniness and cleaniness is godliness and god is empty just like me!"

Can't say I thought very deeply about that in 1995, but now that I think about it, I'll grant three possibilities

1/ He was quite a nuanced negative theologian.
2/ He made an attempt at Nagarjuna, but misread him catastrophically.
3/ The signifiers fit the chord structure reasonably well.

I'm betting three.

:anjali:


well played, sir!
Thanks to the help of generous sponsors (most of them from DharmaWheel), I'm doing a Vajra Armor (Dorje Kotrab) self-retreat this summer. May the merit be yours!
Jikan
Site Admin
 
Posts: 4975
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:04 pm

Re: Karl Max, Communism, and Socialism

Postby ronnewmexico » Sat Nov 05, 2011 11:29 pm

This is deviating significantly from point(so possibly deletable) ...

not to be overtly mystical but I think artists sometimes tap into things especially artists in the throws of some tragic thing in their lives, possibly drugs abuse or some other things.
My personal opinion is many of the things of this sort written perhaps in such pop lyrics books, movie writing, at times many of them are speaking of as unconsciously thought thing of mind. Speaking occasonally from deeper levels, maybe not really aware of what it means.
Stumble upon things at times.
William Burroughs and some others pursued this a bit....as a unconscious pattern evident in all things. If you took a large large numbers of anything written you could basically come up with some inherant patterns of meaning though no conscious mind imbeded them into the subject matter.
Interests me not a whole lot as I find such things need no finding they are there regardless if we care to see them or not.
And I wonder if the meanings of such things change with the times, as perhaps a indicator of a flavor to each time or age.....not really important though.
Some things... such as Einstein reportedly had dreams which incited his insights. I wounder if Karl M..had likewise, to incite his insights?

But Billy C...his apparent association with Ken W and his speaking on Karl J's book of dreams suggest there is some conscious intention there....though I would agree that specific wording is subject to the lyric.
That particular quoted....seems a bit variable and vague I think other works at that time frame seem more to point on this way of thinking.
Some seem explicit, but I would have to dredge up lyrics to show them..seems so. JUst pop dribil to sell a thing...I'd say probably not. The time and music of that time expressed a certain view. Driving off the initial nihilist view of their predessors the original punk rockers. Reflected in their music at times that. Occasionally and rarely I run accross lyrics drawn straight from buddhist source in current music. The artists then be teachers or some such...no of course not.....young people who may have stumbled upon something or drawn from a unconscious thing. Some like Jacob Dylan knowing enough I'd guess from his father to keep things nebulous and vague so more may be applied to it and the audience thusly larger.
His later lyrics..BC's, some are thistic I find quite surely, not before was that present..

To be clear he is not seemingly going to wrestle but starting his own league of sorts as business venture..straight out of Ted Neugent by my read, his playbook. Billy C apparently a big wrestling fan for years.

Deviation done my appologies to intial poster.
"This order considers that progress can be achieved more rapidly during a single month of self-transformation through terrifying conditions in rough terrain and in "the abode of harmful forces" than through meditating for a period of three years in towns and monasteries"....Takpo Tashi Namgyal.
User avatar
ronnewmexico
 
Posts: 1601
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 10:17 pm

Previous

Return to Lounge

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests

>