I need some life advice

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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:52 pm

BuddhaSoup wrote:
Maynoth, respectfully, I am sure there are other options available to you, but perhaps you're feeling a bit blue about this question, and not seeing the options.




Just for some background I've spent 5 years doing research on every career listed on BLS.GOV that has decent pay, and reasonable education requirements.

I've spoken with professionals, and asked lots of people.

I feel I've put more effort into answering this than anyone else would.

I have two options, I can chase wealth, or I can chase my dreams.

If I chase my dreams I'll be in extreme poverty, beyond what I find acceptable.



BuddhaSoup wrote: is a way to disconnect from your daily life, that may not be the healthiest path to take. I've always felt that meditation practice is an integral part of our life, not an escape from it. I hope that your practice helps you along the Bodhisattva Path, versus taking you away from it.


I appreciate the concern, disconnecting for life is not the goal or point.


BuddhaSoup wrote:As far as emigrating to another country, I sort of get that...I was born in the US, and live and work here (and feel myself lucky to do work in a chosen vocation), but in my next life I might wish to be born in Japan, or Ireland, or some other country with fewer gun deaths, less income and wealth disparity, less poverty in the face of extreme wealth at the other end of the spectrum, and as new Secretary of State John Kerry just alluded to a German audience: less stupidity. I'm lucky to have been born here...can you imagine having been born a Rohingyan Muslim in Burma, and now be setting out on a boat to face death at sea, because no country wants you, or your children?


I feel lucky and fortunate to have been born here and not a third world country, but it's bittersweet. To watch us go to war and kill millions over lies, so our corporations and defense contractors can realize a profit. It's sort of like living a good life because you are a member of the mob. I want to live somewhere else where I don't have to feel like I am contributing to a war machine.





BuddhaSoup wrote:I any case, I feel you have myriad options that perhaps you're not seeing right now. Maybe talk with a vocational counselor, or a trusted teacher in your sangha, a therapist or life coach, or a combination of these, and see if there are options available to you that you're not picking up on. At 50, you have a lot of life in you, and these days, 50 is just a halfway point for many of this generation.



I've spoken to career counselors, and a life coach, there isn't any way to have my cake and eat it too. I can choose between a career or my dreams but not both.

I wish there were another way.


I just came asking for opinions if others were faced with such a choice.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby Andrew108 » Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:14 am

When you think enlightenment is something you achieve then the tension inherent in that belief prevents enlightenment. When you think that enlightenment has a cause such as meditating 20 hours a day then the result you get will be conditioned and you will be a long way from genuine enlightenment. If you want some life advice then I would suggest you learn how to relax. And I say this respectfully.
The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:08 pm

Andrew108 wrote:When you think enlightenment is something you achieve then the tension inherent in that belief prevents enlightenment. When you think that enlightenment has a cause such as meditating 20 hours a day then the result you get will be conditioned and you will be a long way from genuine enlightenment. If you want some life advice then I would suggest you learn how to relax. And I say this respectfully.



I am not seeking enlightenment, inner peace, wisdom, equanimity, insight, etc.

What I study is about relaxing ;)
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby LastLegend » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:18 pm

maynoth wrote:
Andrew108 wrote:When you think enlightenment is something you achieve then the tension inherent in that belief prevents enlightenment. When you think that enlightenment has a cause such as meditating 20 hours a day then the result you get will be conditioned and you will be a long way from genuine enlightenment. If you want some life advice then I would suggest you learn how to relax. And I say this respectfully.



I am not seeking enlightenment, inner peace, wisdom, equanimity, insight, etc.

What I study is about relaxing ;)


Wisdom can help you make money.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:27 pm

Really I appreciate it, I do.


But what I am looking for are peoples opinions on the matter.

If you were forced to choose between your dreams and extreme poverty, or giving up your dreams and wealth, which would you pick and why?
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby LastLegend » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:43 pm

maynoth wrote:Really I appreciate it, I do.


But what I am looking for are peoples opinions on the matter.

If you were forced to choose between your dreams and extreme poverty, or giving up your dreams and wealth, which would you pick and why?



I see.

I would choose wealth because I can chase my dreams when I have wealth.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:46 pm

LastLegend wrote:
maynoth wrote:Really I appreciate it, I do.


But what I am looking for are peoples opinions on the matter.

If you were forced to choose between your dreams and extreme poverty, or giving up your dreams and wealth, which would you pick and why?



I see.

I would choose wealth because I can chase my dreams when I have wealth.



Well assume by the time you had wealth, you'd be too old or for some other reason incapable of chasing your dreams.

In that scenario where you cannot have your cake and eat it too, which would you choose?
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby LastLegend » Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:51 pm

maynoth wrote:

Well assume by the time you had wealth, you'd be too old or for some other reason incapable of chasing your dreams.

In that scenario where you cannot have your cake and eat it too, which would you choose?


Dreams
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby Andrew108 » Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:16 pm

maynoth wrote:Really I appreciate it, I do.


But what I am looking for are peoples opinions on the matter.

If you were forced to choose between your dreams and extreme poverty, or giving up your dreams and wealth, which would you pick and why?

I wouldn't pick. I'd just enjoy being relaxed.
The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby Namgyal » Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:22 pm

maynoth wrote: If I were to say the same about what you practice, I'd venture to guess you and most others would be offended by it, so I won't.

I will however say the results I am looking for are only offered by what I am studying

The difference is that we know where Andrew108 is coming from...whereas you are being suspiciously secretive about what religion you actually practice. Nobody minds giving you free life coaching, but it is rather hard to do so when you are concealing all the facts.
:namaste:
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:31 pm

Namgyal wrote:
maynoth wrote: If I were to say the same about what you practice, I'd venture to guess you and most others would be offended by it, so I won't.

I will however say the results I am looking for are only offered by what I am studying

The difference is that we know where Andrew108 is coming from...whereas you are being suspiciously secretive about what religion you actually practice. Nobody minds giving you free life coaching, but it is rather hard to do so when you are concealing all the facts.
:namaste:


I've been as open as I can be. I am just asking for an opinion on what others would do if in such a situation. I am not trying to change the situation I am in.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:32 pm

LastLegend wrote:
maynoth wrote:

Well assume by the time you had wealth, you'd be too old or for some other reason incapable of chasing your dreams.

In that scenario where you cannot have your cake and eat it too, which would you choose?


Dreams



thank you :)
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby justsit » Fri Mar 01, 2013 6:36 pm

maynoth wrote:
I have two options, I can chase wealth, or I can chase my dreams.
If I chase my dreams I'll be in extreme poverty, beyond what I find acceptable [bold mine]....


Sounds like you already made your choice.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Fri Mar 01, 2013 8:15 pm

justsit wrote:
maynoth wrote:
I have two options, I can chase wealth, or I can chase my dreams.
If I chase my dreams I'll be in extreme poverty, beyond what I find acceptable [bold mine]....


Sounds like you already made your choice.


I don't really know what to do at this point, working a full time job no matter what will kill my dreams, and I am going to have to earn at least full time minimum wage to survive.

If I am going to be working 40 or more hours per week anywhere might as well finish my degree and get an internship and get a good paying job.

Without going into extreme poverty I really don't have many options.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby justsit » Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:29 am

Well, I guess it depends on how old you are, and how you define "extreme poverty."

You asked for stories so...
I went back to school when I was in my 30's, got a nursing degree, worked full time for 20 years - then became a student of dharma and quit. My "lifestyle" went from very comfortable to not so comfortable, but I was OK with that because it gave me time to practice. Only....I found out I'm really lazy, and didn't practice (well, not much). So now I am almost at Social Security age, running out of funds, living in what is genteelly known as "reduced circumstances." And...due to the recession, no one will hire me, despite my professional degree and 20+yrs experience, because I'm too old. And...I'm no closer to any kind of realization than I was before (well, maybe a little). So now, I work very part time at whatever work I can find to get enough to eat and pay a few bills, am eating up my savings, and am a half a**ed practitioner.

The moral of this story is....think very hard and be very honest with yourself before you jump in either end of the pool.
One is too shallow, the other too deep. Maybe there's a middle way?
Jolly good luck.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby Thrasymachus » Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:21 am

maynoth wrote:I fantasize a lot about having a home in a very very rural area, and enough money to pay the property taxes till I die, with an 20-30 years worth of food stored away, all solar, with enough money and necessities tucked away to just focus on my training till I die.


I would recommend listening to Charles Eisenstein, he is influenced by Buddhism, but does not try to totally ignore social reality like many Buddhists do. He said in one interview that people want to do good and beautiful things in their lives but they don't because "there is no money there", so what they do instead is spend their lives doing what they don't want to do, and what actually harms society "because there is money there".

maynoth wrote:My problem is my time is running out, I'll be 50 before I can start working in my chosen career if I start now, and I'll be 60 or 70 before I can leave the USA.

How old are you exactly? You hint that you are in your late 40's. No offense, you may think you can go to university and that landing a high paying professional career is realistic, and it may actually happen, nothing is impossible, but the probability is very small. Here is a recent article with some statistics:
LA Times wrote:Nearly half of college grads have jobs that don't require diplomas
January 29, 2013

...

About 48% of college students who graduated in 2010 are in positions that don't need a bachelor's degree, while 38% are working in gigs that don't require even a high school diploma, according to the Center for College Affordability and Productivity.

The report found that the number of workers overeducated for the jobs they were holding down could be growing. In 1970, fewer than 1% of taxi drivers and 2% of firefighters had earned a college diploma; now, more than 15% in both jobs have graduated from college.

...


It is not much better elsewhere in the world either, the capitalist world economy is heading into collapse and decline. But in the USA due to high student debt, the situation is perhaps one of the worst in the developed world for graduating students. You can just search for "student loans" and suicide and see for yourself all the hopeless young graduates and you are not young, so it is not like you will have the advantage of time to pay off the debt mountain. Read and heed carefully to what justsit wrote above. I am trying to get a religious vaccine exemption and am scared about even fighting that, and comparatively speaking I have relative youth on my side. There is an institution called the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) but it is often hard to prove if you were refused a job because of your age or dismissed for the same reason. Despite that it is often harder for older people who trained for a new field late in life to land a job when competing against the established old hands with decades of experience and the youth who are perceived as willing to work for less and put up with more abuse. Those who have the power have the power, laws and regulations allegedly in your favor are a poor substitute. So your chances will be less than those of new and younger graduates, and their chances in most fields are already abysmal.

Ultimately I have come to the conclusion in life that money tends to make people miserable. For example now I live with the damned family and they never let me forget they have money over me, so while being comparatively privileged compared to many in the world, it is still not easy and money is a worry. Eisenstein calls this "survival anxiety" because you need money to have access to resources to live and so many are in constant, prolonged anxiety over money issues. I wish I and everyone else didn't have to worry about money, but that type of world will never be constructed, the poor are too demoralized and those comparatively better off are too comfortable and triumphant. Initially in this thread you were very unrealistic in thinking both options could be pursued, money first and then spirituality. But sadly if you are really in your 40's I don't see that happening, unless I started becoming the type to tell people whatever they wanted to hear. There is this one American, Daniel Suelo that decided to live without using money has been doing it for over a decade. Really I wish I had the balls to live like that, because that is the only future that makes sense or is viable.

It sucks being poor, I wish there was a magic pill or a solution, but there won't be. There are intentional communities you could try to become a member of. You will never own a house, but you will get time to practice. And like others have said even if you are the Western version of poor, you still likely still have "poverty mind". Ivan Illich in the 1970's observed that "Most countries in Latin America have reached the "take-off" point toward economic development and competitive consumption, and thereby toward modernized poverty: their citizens have learned to think rich and live poor." But that is equally true of poor in the developed world too.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:20 pm

I've put much research into this, I can do it.

I'll need 4 years of school, 4 years of self study and 5 years of with an unpaid or low paid internship. After that I can write my own ticket.

If I have 10 years experience, and a masters degree and some extremely high level certifications I can earn nearly as much as a doctor.

It is hugely in demand world wide.
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby justsit » Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:42 pm

maynoth wrote:I've put much research into this, I can do it.

I'll need 4 years of school, 4 years of self study and 5 years of with an unpaid or low paid internship. After that I can write my own ticket.

If I have 10 years experience, and a masters degree and some extremely high level certifications I can earn nearly as much as a doctor.

It is hugely in demand world wide.


May I ask, doing what?
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby maynoth » Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:49 pm

Cisco Network Engineer (CCNP)
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Re: I need some life advice

Postby LastLegend » Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:06 pm

Some people can get rich easily even without a proper education. When they start a business, they do so well while others try to do the same but fail miserably even with a proper education. The only plausible explanation in my view is cause and effects. Give to receive.
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